Reject of the Britain - Race

Post by **Bobby Doorknobs** » 08 Jul 2018, 15:04

Let's hear those nominations...

Post by **Miguel98** » 08 Jul 2018, 15:06

1. Incosistency of the stewards
2. Williams

Post by **Bobby Doorknobs** » 08 Jul 2018, 15:53

I want to briefly mention two relatively inconsequentual cock-ups:

1. The list of Silverstone facts showing that it hosted the first ever Formula 1 Grand Prix in 1950 (Rantbox post on this particular factoid incoming when I have the time)
2. Ben Edwards mentioning that Luigi Villoresi won the 1948 British Grand Prix in an Alfa Romeo during a moment when we were following Charles Leclerc's Sauber (using its Alfa branding as a segue naturally). Luigi Villoresi was driving a Maserati that day, as he had been for nearly his entire racing career before 1949. In fact, I don't believe Mr. Villoresi ever drove an Alfa Romeo in over twenty years of racing...

Anyway, I'm putting these forward for consideration:

Sauber: Double-points to double-DNF. More upsetting is they were looking the strongest they've been all year.
Romain Grosjean: The other hero-to-zero moment was Romain hitting his teammate on the first lap, and then the incident with Sainz (although I'd probably lean towards "racing incident" for the latter)

I thought after Saturday that Williams would be an easy nomination, but the race was business as usual for them. Stewards... yeah, Raikkonen's penalty seemed odd alright.

Meatwad · Post by **Meatwad** » 08 Jul 2018, 15:56

I nominate Brendon Hartley's luck. He seriously seems to be cursed – another big crash in FP3, preventing him from participating in qualifying, and his race ended before it even began...

Post by **Londoner** » 08 Jul 2018, 16:01

1. Santino Ferrucci - Acted like a complete arsewipe all weekend in F2. He deliberately drove into the back of the same driver in both races. It gets even better, because that driver was Arjun Maini...who happens to be Ferrucci's team mate at Trident! His response on Twitter is something else entirely. Easily the most disgraceful performance at Silverstone. :facepalm:

2. Ben Edwards - What Simtek said.

Alextrax52 · Post by **Alextrax52** » 08 Jul 2018, 16:13

Lewis Hamilton and Toto Wolff: Talk about sore losers and crying foul play. Lewis being a miserable git everytime he doesn't win a race is nothing new anymore which is understandable as long as you deliver big results. However suggesting Ferrari used "interesting tactics" (code for: Ferrari told Kimi to hit me deliberately) overstepped the mark a little bit. I guess they were also responsible for his miserable start which put him in that situation in the first place. Toto Wolff did himself no favours either by pretty much backing those claims. Did he not hear that Raikkonen admitted that he made a simple mistake?

Stewards: The clash between Raikkonen and Hamilton here was nowhere near as bad as what Vettel did to Bottas in France yet Seb only got a 5 second penalty and Kimi gets a 10? Talk about a lack of consistency

Sauber: Talk about the highs and lows of F1, From a double points finish in Austria to a double DNF here. And both were self inflicted retirements too so they can't use the mechanical failure card. It's clear that they have genuinely improved as a whole team judging by Ericsson's performances showing that this isn't a case of Leclerc making a poor car look good but making a good car look even better but today was a bit of a reality check

Brendon Hartley's Luck: East Londoner mentions quite regularly that this man turned down a Chip Ganassi drive in Indycar to be a midfielder at best in F1. He must feel so sick right now. Every mechanical problem at Toro Rosso seems to be coming his way right now and he just can't catch a break. may have scored a point in Austria until retiring and then not even starting today. Got to feel for him

Oh yeah a great shout for Santino Ferrucci too: Forced his team-mate off the track in the Feature race and then admitted to deliberately hitting him after the Sprint. His reaction on twitter is easily one of the most appalling I've seen in a long time.

Spectoremg · Post by **Spectoremg** » 08 Jul 2018, 16:31

Freeze-O-Kimi wrote:Lewis Hamilton and Toto Wolff: Talk about sore losers and crying foul play. Lewis being a miserable git everytime he doesn't win a race is nothing new anymore which is understandable as long as you deliver big results. However suggesting Ferrari used "interesting tactics" (code for: Ferrari told Kimi to hit me deliberately) overstepped the mark a little bit. I guess they were also responsible for his miserable start which put him in that situation in the first place. Toto Wolff did himself no favours either by pretty much backing those claims. Did he not hear that Raikkonen admitted that he made a simple mistake?

Stewards: The clash between Raikkonen and Hamilton here was nowhere near as bad as what Vettel did to Bottas in France yet Seb only got a 5 second penalty and Kimi gets a 10? Talk about a lack of consistency

Sauber: Talk about the highs and lows of F1, From a double points finish in Austria to a double DNF here. And both were self inflicted retirements too so they can't use the mechanical failure card. It's clear that they have genuinely improved as a whole team judging by Ericsson's performances showing that this isn't a case of Leclerc making a poor car look good but making a good car look even better but today was a bit of a reality check

Brendon Hartley's Luck: East Londoner mentions quite regularly that this man turned down a Chip Ganassi drive in Indycar to be a midfielder at best in F1. He must feel so sick right now. Every mechanical problem at Toro Rosso seems to be coming his way right now and he just can't catch a break. may have scored a point in Austria until retiring and then not even starting today. Got to feel for him

Oh yeah a great shout for Santino Ferrucci too: Forced his team-mate off the track in the Feature race and then admitted to deliberately hitting him after the Sprint. His reaction on twitter is easily one of the most appalling I've seen in a long time.

I missed the whining so I'll steal this in absentia if you don't mind.

Post by **mario** » 08 Jul 2018, 17:50

Simtek wrote:I want to briefly mention two relatively inconsequentual cock-ups:

1. The list of Silverstone facts showing that it hosted the first ever Formula 1 Grand Prix in 1950 (Rantbox post on this particular factoid incoming when I have the time)
2. Ben Edwards mentioning that Luigi Villoresi won the 1948 British Grand Prix in an Alfa Romeo during a moment when we were following Charles Leclerc's Sauber (using its Alfa branding as a segue naturally). Luigi Villoresi was driving a Maserati that day, as he had been for nearly his entire racing career before 1949. In fact, I don't believe Mr. Villoresi ever drove an Alfa Romeo in over twenty years of racing...

It looks like you are correct about Luigi never driving for Alfa Romeo - he drove for Ferrari, Lancia and Maserati, but not Alfa Romeo as far as I can tell (perhaps because of the death of his brother Emilio whilst driving an early Alfa Romeo 158).

I do agree that Santino Ferrucci's rather toxic and childish attitude definitely deserves some sort of award, even if technically it is not F1 material - the only solace is the hope that his behaviour will kill any chances of staying on in F2 for much longer.

Edit: Well, it seems that Trident are now rallying around Maini and have apologised for the "uncivilized behavior that he was forced to endure not only during this last weekend by Santino Ferrucci and father, who accompanied him."

Perhaps more ominously for him, Trident have also stated that "The contractual implications of what has happened will be dealt with by our lawyers." - which does rather sound like a polite way of saying that he's going to be sacked.

Similarly, Steiner has now confirmed that, over the coming weeks, Haas will also be holding their own internal review into his behaviour - so it sounds as if the consequences are going to hit home pretty quickly for him.

good_Ralf · Post by **good_Ralf** » 08 Jul 2018, 17:54

Bottas' luck - I don't care if he could've made the tyres last, Mercedes made the wrong call on strategy, Bottas just can't do anything get a win right now. But compatriot Mika Hakkinen had a similar run of bad fortune in 1997, and we all know what followed the year after

You-Gee-Eee-Day · Post by **You-Gee-Eee-Day** » 08 Jul 2018, 18:53

Lewis Hamilton for being in a car that can, after a collision, go from 19th to 2nd, and then cry about the situation when almost no one else would be on the podium today.

Post by **Ataxia** » 08 Jul 2018, 18:54

mario wrote:I do agree that Santino Ferrucci's rather toxic and childish attitude definitely deserves some sort of award, even if technically it is not F1 material - the only solace is the hope that his behaviour will kill any chances of staying on in F2 for much longer.

Post by **Bobby Doorknobs** » 08 Jul 2018, 19:00

East Londoner wrote:1. Santino Ferrucci - Acted like a complete arsewipe all weekend in F2. He deliberately drove into the back of the same driver in both races. It gets even better, because that driver was Arjun Maini...who happens to be Ferrucci's team mate at Trident! His response on Twitter is something else entirely. Easily the most disgraceful performance at Silverstone.

Santino Ferrucci wrote:I just did my drug test so I’m all clear

Santino Ferrucci wrote:I just did my drug test so I’m all clear

I... what?!

Post by **mario** » 08 Jul 2018, 19:06

good_Ralf wrote:Bottas' luck - I don't care if he could've made the tyres last, Mercedes made the wrong call on strategy, Bottas just can't do anything get a win right now. But compatriot Mika Hakkinen had a similar run of bad fortune in 1997, and we all know what followed the year after

It was a strange strategy call by Mercedes for both drivers, since they chose to place both drivers into a position where they were having to defend against the two cars which had been consistently faster in the speed traps than they had and on tyres which were harder and more heavily worn.

OK, I can understand wanting to do something different in that situation, but they're perhaps lucky that it didn't backfire quite as much as it could have done.

Ataxia wrote:
mario wrote:I do agree that Santino Ferrucci's rather toxic and childish attitude definitely deserves some sort of award, even if technically it is not F1 material - the only solace is the hope that his behaviour will kill any chances of staying on in F2 for much longer.

Unfortunately, your image isn't showing up at the moment - is it, however, a reference to Trident's comments about placing the matter in the hands of their lawyers?

You-Gee-Eee-Day · Post by **You-Gee-Eee-Day** » 08 Jul 2018, 19:07

Gotta go for the Stewards as well, their special boy can't possibly have anything bad happen to him in a Formula 1 race.

This Could Be You · Post by **This Could Be You** » 08 Jul 2018, 19:08

Despite being seemingly dead-set on taking the ROTY award, Williams found a new low at Silverstone, and one deserving of Reject of the Race- they were slow, as per usual, but their "upgrades" made the car downright dangerous to drive too, with the rear aero stalling accentuated by the new rear wing. It is clear that, even after sacking pretty much their entire design department (bar Lowe) that produced the FW41, Williams are still lost. Lance Stroll's antics while being lapped did them no favours either.

Dishonourable mentions must go to Brendon Hartley's luck (or lack thereof)- he should have at least triple the points he has now - and Santino Ferrucci, for an act of boneheaded stupidity so rejectful, it almost transcended series and took this award.

Post by **Ataxia** » 08 Jul 2018, 19:27

mario wrote:Unfortunately, your image isn't showing up at the moment - is it, however, a reference to Trident's comments about placing the matter in the hands of their lawyers?

Let's just say I've never enjoyed writing up a stewards' report so much...

Enforcer · Post by **Enforcer** » 08 Jul 2018, 20:10

Lewis Hamilton: Team radio has revealed there to be many, many whiners on the F1 grid, and Hamilton's the worst, by far. (And with Vettel and Alonso for competition, that's really saying something). Ferrari had Kimi deliberately run you off? Yeah. Okay. Sure mate, whatever you say. They'd obviously predicted you'd mess up the start and had Kimi ready to pounce.

And another petulant episode with the media too. Why don't you spend a press conference drawing more bunny ears on people in snapchat and then claim the press is out to get you again, yeah?

And what's worse is Mercedes indulge him by treating him like some near irreplaceable ultra precious commodity. Any time there's a problem from the team, they issue grovelling apology after grovelling apology. Where's grovelling apology to the team from Hamilton for lighting up the rears off the start? Where's Mercedes' strategist apologising over the radio to Bottas and making a massive deal out of saying it's his fault for stuffing his strategy?
I don't understand why they're so obsessed with cuddling him. What's he going to do if they're not kissing his feet at every possible turn? Leave? I doubt it. The only other team he'd be able to win the Championship with in the next couple of years is Ferrari where he can't go whilst Vettel is there. And if he did, they could get Ricciardo who's 99.99999% as good (if not 100%) to replace him and have just as much chance as winning the WDC and WCC.

Fetzie · Post by **Fetzie** » 08 Jul 2018, 20:13

You-Gee-Eee-Day wrote:Gotta go for the Stewards as well, their special boy can't possibly have anything bad happen to him in a Formula 1 race.

I think I heard from Brawn in an interview that the stewards would be taking the result of a collision into account going forward after Vettel's punishment for colliding with Bottas was widely regarded as too lenient (I don't remember where I read it though).

Anyway, my nominations are

1 - Lewis Hamilton for being in a stinking mood after progressing back to where he was before Raikönnen hit his rear tyre (and getting let past by Bottas)
2 - Valterri Bottas' luck

Honourable mentions to Brendan Hartley's luck, and Sauber for throwing points away (especially after Leclerc's recent run of form).

UncreativeUsername37 · Post by **UncreativeUsername37** » 08 Jul 2018, 22:13

I nominate the Britsh Grand Prix.

Klon · Post by **Klon** » 09 Jul 2018, 10:50

UgncreativeUsergname wrote:I nominate the Britsh Grand Prix.

I dislike the British as much as anyone, but I am afraid I will have to call you out and request a reasoning. It was a rather entertaining race this time around and with Silverstone, that is not a given.

Post by **tommykl** » 09 Jul 2018, 11:56

Klon wrote:
UgncreativeUsergname wrote:I nominate the Britsh Grand Prix.

I dislike the British as much as anyone, but I am afraid I will have to call you out and request a reasoning. It was a rather entertaining race this time around and with Silverstone, that is not a given.

I believe that's a reference to this occurrence during the race:

dr-baker · Post by **dr-baker** » 09 Jul 2018, 12:55

Having the DRS zone encompassing Abbey and Farm turns did seem to generate some crashes, as I predicted in my Predicament Predictions entry, so I will go for that...

girry · Post by **girry** » 09 Jul 2018, 13:08

Well Ferrucci truly is making an effort for the Reject of the Race.

Klon · Post by **Klon** » 09 Jul 2018, 14:43

tommykl wrote:
Klon wrote:
UgncreativeUsergname wrote:I nominate the Britsh Grand Prix.

I dislike the British as much as anyone, but I am afraid I will have to call you out and request a reasoning. It was a rather entertaining race this time around and with Silverstone, that is not a given.

I believe that's a reference to this occurrence during the race:

This happened again!? How!?

I whoosed, give me and Liberty Media's intern ROTR.

Enforcer · Post by **Enforcer** » 09 Jul 2018, 17:04

I'm withdrawing my nomination for Hamilton because, in an unusual move for an F1 driver, he's actually shown a bit of contrition about his remarks. Fair dos.

I'm left to nominate Williams, for yet another shocking weekend. Should we be surprised that one of only 2-3 privateer teams (depending on definition) is struggling badly? Maybe not in one sense, but equally this isn't a Caterham or HRT or even a Jordan. This is Williams, who are the second most successful team by constructors titles and third most successful by race wins. Surely this is not their future?

Alextrax52 · Post by **Alextrax52** » 09 Jul 2018, 22:48

After reading all the extra reaction today I too am going to rescind the Hamilton nomination. Fair play to him for admitting he said something stupid which was in the heat of the moment (he's put it down to physical exhaustion which would also mean your not in a good mental frame of mind either)

That said I'm going to keep Toto Wolff's nomination because although I understand he wanted to defend his driver, the context that Hamilton initially implied wasn't one to take extremely seriously. Kimi's wife Minttu has caused a bit of a storm with an Instagram snap that implied that if they can't take losing they should try ballet. She later explained she was having a dig at the Mercedes team and not Hamilton individually. Personally I think she has a point, Mercedes have had it so easy since the turbo hybrid era started that maybe they've become too comfortable with cruising to both championships. We saw Vettel's promise last season in winning 5 races and this season Ferrari are not only equal to Mercedes on slower tracks, they're eroding the gap on pro-Mercedes tracks too and Red Bull can genuinely best them on the slower ones, Mercedes are being stretched this season and they don't like it

Ciaran · Post by **Ciaran** » 10 Jul 2018, 09:14

Williams - it's times like these my nostalgia for DNQs intensifies.
Toto Wolff - I can understand a driver getting lost in the heat of the moment and accusing another of intentionally hitting him, but his bathplugging team principal?

yannicksamlad · Post by **yannicksamlad** » 10 Jul 2018, 09:25

I'll echo dr-baker's comments on the stupidity of having Farm and Abbey as a DRS zone - that turned out to be expensive and basically dangerous , for no really good reason reason ( except perhaps some machismo element, and possibly a need to have a 3rd DRS zone "because other tracks are doing it") . I dont think it added much to overtaking , or spectacle.

And then Mr Ferrucci..has to be a contender. And technically associated with F1 through his Haas deal . And it wasnt just a moment of on-track madness - refused to go to stewards, various other 'nastiness' out the car...

Jan Magnussen · Post by **Rob Dylan** » 10 Jul 2018, 13:29

Ok doke, here we go:

- Räikkönen's penalty: A little outrageous. To me it seemed clearly a racing incident, and didn't require a penalty of that magnitude.
- Williams: shortly before Qualifying, Clare Williams was on stage talking about how this track would suit them much better, and they expected a double-Q2 performance this weekend. Half an hour later, oh no :facepalm:

- Max Verstappen: this is more of a dishonourable mention, but throughout most of the weekend there was something in the air that implied Max was going to have one of his weekends. He was decent in Q and the race, but there were a lot of crashes and issues.
- The A- and B-Team system in Formula 1: the Silverstone radio regularly referred to Hulkenberg, Magnussen and others as winning the "B race". It was nice that they were giving shout-outs to people doing well who aren't in the top 6, but it was also kind of depressing that everyone's conscious of two tiers of F1.
- DRS on the Hangar Straight: It was awesome to see Hamilton overtake all those cars in front of me (I was at Stowe), but it was certainly too easy for him. After the second or third overtake, it was obvious that nobody was even going to try to block him or make him fight for the overtake.
- Romain Grosjean: It's that kind of hero-to-zero disaster that we saw in Silverstone that makes you a strong contender for Reject of the Year.

Also:
- The crowd that cheered maniacally for Nico Rosberg when he stood and waved from the pit-wall after the race: All I could think was that these very same people cheering for him were booing and whistling him incessantly the last time I was at Silverstone. Probably the only insufferable moment I had at the track.

Wallio · Post by **Wallio** » 10 Jul 2018, 15:17

Since the junior series thread is locked, I'll give my thoughts on Ferrucci here, who undoubtedly was reject of the weekend. Now, I was away this weekend, and only saw the video of his incident, and I must admit, I felt the punishment was WAY overboard.

Right or wrong, incidents on the cooldown lap or under caution, even among teammates, are quite common over here, and being American, I merely shrugged.

But now? With everything that has come out? Ignoring THREE summons to the stewards? Openly being racist to your teammate? Texting and driving in a bathplugging FORMULA TWO CAR??? The kid is a friggin idiot. I know Haas needs money, but damn man, get somebody else.

Also, for what its worth, during MRN's broadcast of the Indycar Detroit races, they talked at no small length about Ferrucci's issues with the rest of the paddock. The Indy boys felt he had an attitude. Guess we know.

Jan Magnussen · Post by **Rob Dylan** » 12 Jul 2018, 11:01

Four options up for the next 48 hours. There were a lot of popular suggestions, and so I tried my best to narrow it down to the best four. Once again, sorry if yours wasn't on the list.

Get voting :chilton:

Post by **Bobby Doorknobs** » 12 Jul 2018, 12:07

Rob Dylan wrote:Four options up for the next 48 hours. There were a lot of popular suggestions, and so I tried my best to narrow it down to the best four. Once again, sorry if yours wasn't on the list.

Get voting

As utterly stupid as he was, Santino Ferrucci shouldn't be a serious nominee. I'd suggest changing it to either the DRS zone through Abbey, or Sauber.

Klon · Post by **Klon** » 12 Jul 2018, 14:52

Simtek wrote:As utterly stupid as he was, Santino Ferrucci shouldn't be a serious nominee. I'd suggest changing it to either the DRS zone through Abbey, or Sauber.

Why not? Off-track drama got ROTR back in the old days more than once, so I do not see why a F2 driver should not be eligible to receive ROTR. We must resist the temptation of being too strict about this for-fun award. It admittedly makes predicting the ROTR even harder than usual for the prediction game, but that's no reason to not do it.

UncreativeUsername37 · Post by **UncreativeUsername37** » 12 Jul 2018, 16:14

Klon wrote:
Simtek wrote:As utterly stupid as he was, Santino Ferrucci shouldn't be a serious nominee. I'd suggest changing it to either the DRS zone through Abbey, or Sauber.

Why not? Off-track drama got ROTR back in the old days more than once, so I do not see why a F2 driver should not be eligible to receive ROTR. We must resist the temptation of being too strict about this for-fun award. It admittedly makes predicting the ROTR even harder than usual for the prediction game, but that's no reason to not do it.

But it should be related to F1....

Post by **Bobby Doorknobs** » 12 Jul 2018, 16:44

UgncreativeUsergname wrote:
Klon wrote:
Simtek wrote:As utterly stupid as he was, Santino Ferrucci shouldn't be a serious nominee. I'd suggest changing it to either the DRS zone through Abbey, or Sauber.

Why not? Off-track drama got ROTR back in the old days more than once, so I do not see why a F2 driver should not be eligible to receive ROTR. We must resist the temptation of being too strict about this for-fun award. It admittedly makes predicting the ROTR even harder than usual for the prediction game, but that's no reason to not do it.

But it should be related to F1....

I was pretty much going to say this, but I've also thought: What about changing the nomination to Haas?

- While they were excellent in qualifying, they tangled on the first lap, and spent the majority of the race trying to beat Ocon and the Renaults (and Leclerc before he retired), ending up with just two points
- Grosjean's incident with Sainz
- And of course, the theatrics from their reserve driver in the F2 paddock and races

Salamander · Post by **Salamander** » 12 Jul 2018, 17:14

Come on, Santino Ferrucci is at least tangentially related to F1, as a Haas Junior driver racing in the designated F1 feeder series. It's not like that time a bunch of us voted for Scott McLaughlin, a man who has absolutely no relevance to F1 whatsoever.

Jan Magnussen · Post by **Rob Dylan** » 12 Jul 2018, 18:05

I was seriously considering not putting Ferucci in the list, but the fact is that he received far more nominations than anyone else, so I suppose I felt obliged to put him in. If people want to seriously vote for him, go ahead imo. But if people don't like that way of doing things, I won't do that in future.

Post by **mario** » 13 Jul 2018, 06:57

Rob Dylan wrote:I was seriously considering not putting Ferucci in the list, but the fact is that he received far more nominations than anyone else, so I suppose I felt obliged to put him in. If people want to seriously vote for him, go ahead imo. But if people don't like that way of doing things, I won't do that in future.

I had wondered about it, but Salamander does have a point that Santino does have a limited connection to F1 via being Haas's test driver and having participated in a test session.

Steiner has also indicated that Haas are "reconsidering their contractual relationship" with him as a result of his antics, so it does seem as if the consequences of his actions are spilling over into F1 as well.

Jan Magnussen · Post by **Rob Dylan** » 15 Jul 2018, 17:34

You know what's more exciting than the World Cup? The Reject of the Race award!

In a somewhat controversial decision (my fault, sorry), the Reject-public have voted for Santino Ferrucci! The F2 driver has now been disqualified from the second race at Silverstone and banned for the next two rounds (which is four races) for his antics involving hitting his teammate more than once, and then following it up with harrassment (with racial factors), not turning up to the hearing, and a bunch of other stuff. A Haas F1 test driver, he is likely to have ended his chances at a career at top-level motorsport with his sorry weekend, and so he certainly deserves Reject of the Race.

Pick your Reject of the Race!