Vettel leaves Ferrari

[IceG]

Thought this deserved its own thread rather than the 2020 Silly Season one

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/formula1/52612216

[dr-baker]

Thought this deserved its own thread rather than the 2020 Silly Season one

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/formula1/52612216

Might be more suited to a 2021 Silly Season thread to be honest.

It's going to be interesting to see what Vettel does instead.

[mario]

Thought this deserved its own thread rather than the 2020 Silly Season one

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/formula1/52612216

Might be more suited to a 2021 Silly Season thread to be honest.

It's going to be interesting to see what Vettel does instead.

Strictly speaking, I'd agree that is probably correct (given it's the end of this year that Vettel's contract runs out).

I wouldn't be surprised if we see Vettel leave F1 altogether at the end of the season, as I get the sense that he is not enthusiastic about the prospect of an ever lengthening calendar when he wants to spend more time with his family. I could see him doing something like the World Endurance Championship, as I get the sense he might still want to do some racing (but with a more widely spaced calendar), perhaps with occasional spots as a pundit.

The speculation on who might replace him also seems to be kicking off quite rapidly too, with people seemingly throwing the names of Sainz and Ricciardo around, along with Giovinazzi.

[Enforcer]

He didn't help himself, especially in 2018, but that's consecutive multiple WDCs at Ferrari who weren't able to do the business with them and left under a bit of a cloud.

Would be fun if they could somehow get Hamilton and see could they do the same to him. Y'know, just to complete that generation's top drivers.

I'd guess Binotto's inbox is filling up with voicemails from Ricciardo right now. Whether Ferrari want to throw everything behind Leclerc and get a Bottas in as #2, or if they think they need a more experienced driver with race wins under his belt (like Ricciardo) to lead the team is the thing.

They also presumably have a medium term eye on Max.

[Paul Hayes]

I must admit I'm not *completely* surprised by the Vettel news. After last season it always felt as if the writing was on the wall for him at Ferrari. Another one to add to the list with Alonso and particularly those from the 1980-95 period where they went to resurrect Ferrari and it never *quite* came off.

[dinizintheoven]

And if I was Nico Hülkenberg, I'd be getting on the phone to my agent...

[UncreativeUsername37]

Boom! After absolutely nothing for months apart from countries saying they're ready and then they're not ready, we get some big F1 news. We'll we talking about this for weeks because, well, what else is there?

It's the same thing he did when leaving Red Bull, though... a teammate does better than him, so he decides to try his luck somewhere else. Or nowhere else?! Hmm, Red Bull... Verstappen's teammates haven't been too great, have they... I really don't think Verstappen would appreciate being against an actual proven driver, though, given previous statements along the lines of "he isn't a number one, but yeah, he totally is".

So, how long before Ricciardo is announced?

[mario]

Boom! After absolutely nothing for months apart from countries saying they're ready and then they're not ready, we get some big F1 news. We'll we talking about this for weeks because, well, what else is there?

It's the same thing he did when leaving Red Bull, though... a teammate does better than him, so he decides to try his luck somewhere else. Or nowhere else?! Hmm, Red Bull... Verstappen's teammates haven't been too great, have they... I really don't think Verstappen would appreciate being against an actual proven driver, though, given previous statements along the lines of "he isn't a number one, but yeah, he totally is".

So, how long before Ricciardo is announced?

Whilst Ricciardo might be a popular figure, it sounds as if Sainz's name is being thrown about as the front runner for that seat (Verstappen seems to have hinted in that direction https://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/max- ... l/4791458/ ). The Italian version of the Motorsport Network has even gone as far as claiming that Sainz already has a pre-contract and that he will be formally confirmed in the next 48 hours, but most other sites are being more cautious and only suggesting that Sainz is the preferred candidate.

I suppose another question might be "what length of contract will be offered", as that could be an interesting illustration of Ferrari's plans. Vettel was, supposedly, only offered a one year contract on a reduced salary - I wonder whether any potential alternative might be offered a similarly short contract?

[Francis23]

Autosport are now reporting that Sainz will replace Vettel, announcement later this week...

Who gets the 2nd McLaren seat then? Hulk maybe?

[tBone]

Autosport are now reporting that Sainz will replace Vettel, announcement later this week...

Who gets the 2nd McLaren seat then? Hulk maybe?

According to Leo Turrini, Riccardo is on his way there..

So who will join Renault then? Hulk maybe?

[Paul Hayes]

That was all very quick! We don't even get a silly season at this rate, never mind a proper season!

[Alextrax52]

While it is a surprise to see this announced this early I’m not surprised he’s going. His heart hasn’t been in it for about 18 months now and it all started with that mistake in Germany 2 years ago. I said at the end of that year if Leclerc had the better of him in 2019 it would signal the end of him with a top team and I think I’m going to be proved right. Red Bull aren’t going to take him back because Max is the main man and he’d be playing second fiddle there plus they probably couldn’t afford to pay both of them high wages, Mercedes will look to tie at least Hamilton down so that creates a similar situation and I can’t see him being too willing to step down to McLaren or Renault with the current structure of 6 cars being so much faster than the other 14. I think he’ll retire, he’s 33 in July, has a family with 3 kids and has virtually won it all in the sport.

As for the other seats it’s being reported that Sainz will take the Ferrari seat and Ricciardo will fill the opening at McLaren. All eyes on that Renault seat then. Do they promote a current reserve driver or will one of the F2 drivers with Renault connections get it. Time will tell

[mario]

Autosport are now reporting that Sainz will replace Vettel, announcement later this week...

Who gets the 2nd McLaren seat then? Hulk maybe?

According to Leo Turrini, Riccardo is on his way there..

So who will join Renault then? Hulk maybe?

Some have suggested it's a three way swap between those drivers - Sainz to Ferrari, Ricciardo to McLaren and Vettel to Renault - though that might simply be based on the assumption that Renault seat would be the main one available if Vettel does stay on in F1.

That said, it might not be too far fetched that Renault might find themselves rehiring Hulkenberg. Right now, I think that maybe Lundgaard might qualify for a superlicence - but sticking a rookie into the team when Ocon isn't a hugely experienced driver and has had to spend over a year out of the sport is a risky strategy. They might well be wanting to hire a more experienced driver in that case - and there aren't many reasonably young drivers with recent experience in the sport they could opt for.

[dinizintheoven]

Assessing everything, I'd say we're about to see the last of Sebastian Vettel in F1. He's had a full-time drive since mid-2007, which I suppose makes a 13-year career in total once this half-season is over, and that's more than a lot of drivers will ever get. Plus, there's the small matter of those 53 wins and four World Championships, even if two of those were effectively handed to him on a silver plate. Pundits are already discussing whether he was worth any of those World Championships, the Lewis fanboys and the Alonso fanboys and the Max fanboys are all having their say... he was no good, he was a charlatan all along, so was Lewis say the Alonso and Max fanboys, why didn't he win a title or two with Ferrari if he's so great, why didn't Alonso do the same, and so on, and so on, and so on, ad nauseam. To embellish his career, he may want to indulge in endurance racing, have a crack at Le Mans or Indy, maybe he'll try DTM or GT500. Or maybe, he'll conclude that there's more to life than driving around in circles...

I've always seen Sebastian Vettel as someone who doesn't much care for the limelight, especially if his family are involved; it's almost as if he's the middle ground between Lewis Hamilton, who craves media attention and will do anything to attract it, and Kimi Räikkönen, who actively makes a show of shunning it. When the media spotlight does shine on him, he doesn't always know how to handle it - which I reckon only serves to reinforce the time he's had serious errors of judgement, such as that day in Baku. Plenty of ex-F1 drivers who had a lot less success than Seb has, went on to have fulfilling lives that nobody outside the F1 circus noticed - Jody Scheckter running his organic farm, Eddie Irvine going into property development, Thierry Boutsen selling aeroplanes to people with pockets so deep they could be used to extract geothermal energy. So at this point I'd expect Seb to buy a cottage with a load of land in the Swiss Alps, raise his family as normally as is possible for an ex-F1 driver and become a full-time spoon-whittler - at least until the day that Christian Horner gets on the phone and says "hey, Seb, want to rejoin us and be a brand ambassador?" just to keep the bank account even healthier than it already is and, barring an utter catastrophe, always will be. And whether or not the *autistic screeching* about his career and achievements falls silent, Seb is going to sit back, polish his trophies and think "all things considered, the history books will say I did all right." And as long as his family is secure for life, that's all that's likely to matter.

[CaptainGetz12]

Assessing everything, I'd say we're about to see the last of Sebastian Vettel in F1. He's had a full-time drive since mid-2007, which I suppose makes a 13-year career in total once this half-season is over, and that's more than a lot of drivers will ever get. Plus, there's the small matter of those 53 wins and four World Championships, even if two of those were effectively handed to him on a silver plate. Pundits are already discussing whether he was worth any of those World Championships, the Lewis fanboys and the Alonso fanboys and the Max fanboys are all having their say... he was no good, he was a charlatan all along, so was Lewis say the Alonso and Max fanboys, why didn't he win a title or two with Ferrari if he's so great, why didn't Alonso do the same, and so on, and so on, and so on, ad nauseam. To embellish his career, he may want to indulge in endurance racing, have a crack at Le Mans or Indy, maybe he'll try DTM or GT500. Or maybe, he'll conclude that there's more to life than driving around in circles...

I've always seen Sebastian Vettel as someone who doesn't much care for the limelight, especially if his family are involved; it's almost as if he's the middle ground between Lewis Hamilton, who craves media attention and will do anything to attract it, and Kimi Räikkönen, who actively makes a show of shunning it. When the media spotlight does shine on him, he doesn't always know how to handle it - which I reckon only serves to reinforce the time he's had serious errors of judgement, such as that day in Baku. Plenty of ex-F1 drivers who had a lot less success than Seb has, went on to have fulfilling lives that nobody outside the F1 circus noticed - Jody Scheckter running his organic farm, Eddie Irvine going into property development, Thierry Boutsen selling aeroplanes to people with pockets so deep they could be used to extract geothermal energy. So at this point I'd expect Seb to buy a cottage with a load of land in the Swiss Alps, raise his family as normally as is possible for an ex-F1 driver and become a full-time spoon-whittler - at least until the day that Christian Horner gets on the phone and says "hey, Seb, want to rejoin us and be a brand ambassador?" just to keep the bank account even healthier than it already is and, barring an utter catastrophe, always will be. And whether or not the *autistic screeching* about his career and achievements falls silent, Seb is going to sit back, polish his trophies and think "all things considered, the history books will say I did all right." And as long as his family is secure for life, that's all that's likely to matter.

Remember, it's not what you know, it's who you know

I can see Vettel becoming a rather forgotten multi-time champion (how many people know that Nelson Piquet is a 3-time champion?). 5 years ago I'd put Vettel in the same vein as Hamilton; a young, erratic hotshot who needs more control over their pace, but I do see him mellow out somewhat. Perhaps his time at Ferrari humbled him, contrasting Alonso, whose Ferrari stint made him make more rash decisions. And considering that rash decisions ruined Alonso's chances of ever winning another race, let alone a championship I'm sure Vettel is being careful about any moves to elsewhere on the grid.

I can't see him as maverick enough to take Le Mans or Indy by storm either like Fernando has either, but who knows!

[tBone]

I was just thinking.. In my opinion, Perez would have been an ideal candidate for the #2 seat at Ferrari. Did he sign his extension with Racing Point too soon?

[Klon]

I was just thinking.. In my opinion, Perez would have been an ideal candidate for the #2 seat at Ferrari. Did he sign his extension with Racing Point too soon?

No, mostly because Ferrari is not looking to have a number two driver. They are looking for young drivers. My guess, from the PR quotes and the fact that they extended Leclerc as long as they did, is that Ferrari upper management has finally drawn the right conclusions from the 2019 downfall and the presumed failure of the SF1000: the way the team operates clearly isn't working no more. Getting the jump on the 2017 regulations delayed that realisation by a few years, but by now they must be aware, like everyone is, that some organisational reform will be needed. Only took failing to win a title with the either of the two best drivers of this generation...

[IceG]

It is pretty telling that (i) Ferrari chose Sainz over Vettel and Alonso, (ii) Mclaren chose Ricciardo over Vettel and Alonso and (iii) Renault haven't yet noticed that they only have one driver - they haven't even updated their wikipedia page yet.

The speed with which both Ferrari and Mclaren responded was impressive, almost like this situation was forseen and planned for. Truly great organisations (sporting, military, political, etc.) game many events and outcomes and so are prepared with playbooks and solutions for what others see as the "unexpected". Much like a few governments didn't do in the current circumstances.

I imagine Mercedes and RBR had also thought this one through and thought "meh" to the prospect of either older driver joining and being guaranteed to destabilise successful set-ups with proven #1 drivers.

So who goes to Renault and why? Seems like Flavio is not getting calls: https://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/deto ... e/4793578/

[UncreativeUsername37]

2020 might have some awkward moments. Three people (at least) in the top half of the grid will be leaving their teams, and Ricciardo will surely in some moments be racing the team he's going to join, so cue the conspiracy theories.... Sainz might get a lot of attention about his time at Ferrari that doesn't exist yet. And there's McLaren in their last year of Renault. If Vettel hasn't announced anything, every show of annoyance or bit of poor performance will bring up another retirement discussion.

Ricciardo will feel hard done by not to be chosen by Ferrari, but hey, he and Norris will be the smiliest driver pairing in the world. Pérez a little bit too, but we all know Mercedes is the top team he belongs in... the 2021 Mercedes seats, we'll be hearing a lot of guessing games about that one, but that's fine, it's important enough to deserve it.

During 2019, I thought it was weird how much discussion there was about 2021 compared to 2020. I don't remember 2014 crushing 2013 like that. But now look at where focussing on 2020 would've got us. Funny how things work out when you have a massive amount of future knowledge to apply. Okay, maybe it isn't.

[mario]

It is pretty telling that (i) Ferrari chose Sainz over Vettel and Alonso, (ii) Mclaren chose Ricciardo over Vettel and Alonso and (iii) Renault haven't yet noticed that they only have one driver - they haven't even updated their wikipedia page yet.

The speed with which both Ferrari and Mclaren responded was impressive, almost like this situation was forseen and planned for. Truly great organisations (sporting, military, political, etc.) game many events and outcomes and so are prepared with playbooks and solutions for what others see as the "unexpected". Much like a few governments didn't do in the current circumstances.

I imagine Mercedes and RBR had also thought this one through and thought "meh" to the prospect of either older driver joining and being guaranteed to destabilise successful set-ups with proven #1 drivers.

So who goes to Renault and why? Seems like Flavio is not getting calls: https://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/deto ... e/4793578/

Or maybe it wasn't quite as quick as we first thought, as Sainz seems to have now suggested he's been talking to Ferrari since the end of the 2019 season - with the key detail being that he also told McLaren that he was going to be talking to Ferrari.

If that is the case, then it suggests that both sides have had several months to prepare for this announcement and the way in which this was announced probably was co-ordinated between the two sides.

[IceG]

If that is the case, then it suggests that both sides have had several months to prepare for this announcement and the way in which this was announced probably was co-ordinated between the two sides.

That is essentially what I was trying to say, i.e. that Ferrari wanted Vettel out and had already got a plan in place and contracts signed...