2021 Discussion Thread

The place for speaking your mind on current goings-on in F1
Post Reply
User avatar
Barbazza
Posts: 1636
Joined: 30 Mar 2009, 19:30

Re: 2021 Discussion Thread - Azerbaijan GP discussion!

Post by Barbazza »

I wouldn't be at all surprised if that was the case. Certainly MIchael Masi seems to be in 'yeah, whatever' mode judging by the conversation we heard today...
User avatar
Rob Dylan
Posts: 3477
Joined: 18 May 2014, 15:34
Location: Andy Warhol's basement

Re: 2021 Discussion Thread - Azerbaijan GP discussion!

Post by Rob Dylan »

That was a race in very serious danger of angering almost everyone.

If anyone other than Pérez had won it would have been a travesty. Max crashed, he was out, they shouldn't have red-flagged it to allow him to win. They also shouldn't have restarted the race after the red flag. They should have just done what they've always done and put the safety car out, and get them to safely make their way to the finish line.

I have the feeling that many people's joy out of those last two laps was just from seeing Hamilton finish outside the points. If it were Pérez or Vettel in 15th come race end there would have been a lot more sour faces I'm sure :x
Murray Walker at the 1997 Austrian Grand Prix wrote:The other [Stewart] driver, who nobody's been paying attention to, because he's disappointing, is Jan Magnussen.
Felipe Nasr - the least forgettable F1 driver!
IceG
Posts: 681
Joined: 06 Oct 2011, 17:24
Location: London (the one in England)

Re: 2021 Discussion Thread - Azerbaijan GP discussion!

Post by IceG »

I would swear I heard a very worried-sounding Stroll say "red flag - get me out of here" while he sat in his stationary car while other cars whizzed past at 200mph. A not unreasonable request under the circumstances.

Would be interesting to know why it was handled under yellows while Max's incident needed reds.

IMHO Stroll's should have been a red flag too.
User avatar
Paul Hayes
Posts: 1101
Joined: 17 Apr 2009, 19:54

Re: 2021 Discussion Thread - Azerbaijan GP discussion!

Post by Paul Hayes »

Well, that was a pretty good one!

I was surprised to see the BBC News Online report describe it as a "snorefest" before the incidents, as I still found it to be an engaging race, but the safety car and then of course the red flag and restart did ratchet up the drama. I'm glad they did go for the red flag option rather than ending it under the safety car.

I'm also glad both Verstappen and Hamilton failed to score, as obviously had it just been one or the other it would have dented this great title fight they currently have.

Amazing to think that had there been another lap or two, Vettel might have won it!

But many drivers and teams happy after a good day, and lots of drama.

There was a superb moment I really loved just before the final restart, with about a minute and a half to go on the countdown timer, when the pitlane seemed to fall silent and you got various shots of drivers and mechanics poised and ready, with an odd feeling of stillness and quiet, before the engines all then started firing into life. Loved that.
User avatar
mario
Posts: 8091
Joined: 31 Oct 2009, 17:13

Re: 2021 Discussion Thread - Azerbaijan GP discussion!

Post by mario »

IceG wrote:I would swear I heard a very worried-sounding Stroll say "red flag - get me out of here" while he sat in his stationary car while other cars whizzed past at 200mph. A not unreasonable request under the circumstances.

Would be interesting to know why it was handled under yellows while Max's incident needed reds.

IMHO Stroll's should have been a red flag too.

He did indeed say that, and I don't blame him for being scared of being hit by another driver whilst being stranded on the straight.

As for why that wasn't a red flag situation, we've now had Masi come out after the race and strongly indicate that the reason why those two events were treated differently was "the show".

He's confirmed that he didn't red flag the race when Stroll crashed because "in the middle of the race, there was more than enough time, and space on the right-hand side of the track when we were recovering it" - basically, the attitude was that he didn't want to stop the race with a red flag, so they used yellow flags, and then the safety car, to keep the race going.

However, in the case of Verstappen, as they wouldn't be able to clear the track in time for the race to finish without a safety car, Masi then decided that it would be "in the interests of the sport" to stop the race and then restart it so it could be completed under green flag conditions - basically, the desire to create more action by restarting the race became the overriding priority.
Martin Brundle, on watching a replay of Grosjean spinning:
"The problem with Grosjean is that he want to take a look back at the corner he's just exited"
User avatar
Miguel98
Posts: 2450
Joined: 30 Mar 2014, 09:18
Location: Somewhere in Portugal

Re: 2021 Discussion Thread - Azerbaijan GP discussion!

Post by Miguel98 »

mario wrote:
IceG wrote:I would swear I heard a very worried-sounding Stroll say "red flag - get me out of here" while he sat in his stationary car while other cars whizzed past at 200mph. A not unreasonable request under the circumstances.

Would be interesting to know why it was handled under yellows while Max's incident needed reds.

IMHO Stroll's should have been a red flag too.

He did indeed say that, and I don't blame him for being scared of being hit by another driver whilst being stranded on the straight.

As for why that wasn't a red flag situation, we've now had Masi come out after the race and strongly indicate that the reason why those two events were treated differently was "the show".

He's confirmed that he didn't red flag the race when Stroll crashed because "in the middle of the race, there was more than enough time, and space on the right-hand side of the track when we were recovering it" - basically, the attitude was that he didn't want to stop the race with a red flag, so they used yellow flags, and then the safety car, to keep the race going.

However, in the case of Verstappen, as they wouldn't be able to clear the track in time for the race to finish without a safety car, Masi then decided that it would be "in the interests of the sport" to stop the race and then restart it so it could be completed under green flag conditions - basically, the desire to create more action by restarting the race became the overriding priority.


Do you have a link for that, mario?

EDIT: Nevermind, found it. https://www.racefans.net/2021/06/06/why-verstappens-crash-caused-a-red-flag-but-strolls-didnt/

Oh my god. So did he look at the ratings NASCAR pull these days and thought "yes, this is the future of the sport"?
Mario on Gutierrez after the Italian Grand Prix wrote:He's no longer just a bit of a tool, he's the entire tool set.


18-07-2015: Forever in our hearts Jules.
25-08-2015: Forever in our hearts Justin.
User avatar
razta
Posts: 756
Joined: 03 Apr 2009, 07:58
Location: Frankfurt, Germany

Re: 2021 Discussion Thread - Azerbaijan GP discussion!

Post by razta »


Maaak's reaction..
User avatar
UncreativeUsername37
Posts: 3420
Joined: 25 May 2012, 14:36
Location: Earth

Re: 2021 Discussion Thread - Azerbaijan GP discussion!

Post by UncreativeUsername37 »

Rob Dylan wrote:I have the feeling that many people's joy out of those last two laps was just from seeing Hamilton finish outside the points. If it were Pérez or Vettel in 15th come race end there would have been a lot more sour faces I'm sure

This is pretty much me, but not out of a dislike for Hamilton. I'm glad that after Verstappen suffered a totally undeserved retirement, the points between them ended up not changing.
Rob Dylan wrote:Mercedes paying homage to the other W12 chassis by breaking down 30 minutes in
Alextrax52
Posts: 2943
Joined: 17 Apr 2013, 20:06
Location: Bromborough near Liverpool

Re: 2021 Discussion Thread - Azerbaijan GP discussion!

Post by Alextrax52 »

For those who haven’t seen it, click here to see Bottas’s restart. It left me wondering if he’s even trying anymore

https://twitter.com/southbearyt/status/ ... 91809?s=21
User avatar
Miguel98
Posts: 2450
Joined: 30 Mar 2014, 09:18
Location: Somewhere in Portugal

Re: 2021 Discussion Thread - Azerbaijan GP discussion!

Post by Miguel98 »



Yeah. This men isn't competent for this job.
Mario on Gutierrez after the Italian Grand Prix wrote:He's no longer just a bit of a tool, he's the entire tool set.


18-07-2015: Forever in our hearts Jules.
25-08-2015: Forever in our hearts Justin.
User avatar
Rob Dylan
Posts: 3477
Joined: 18 May 2014, 15:34
Location: Andy Warhol's basement

Re: 2021 Discussion Thread - Azerbaijan GP discussion!

Post by Rob Dylan »

Masi has been really building up that reputation slowly to be a Reject of the Year candidate actually. If he keeps up this level of tomfoolery for the rest of the year I would say he's on the podium at least.
Murray Walker at the 1997 Austrian Grand Prix wrote:The other [Stewart] driver, who nobody's been paying attention to, because he's disappointing, is Jan Magnussen.
Felipe Nasr - the least forgettable F1 driver!
User avatar
Ducktanian
Posts: 315
Joined: 28 Mar 2010, 14:45

Re: 2021 Discussion Thread - Azerbaijan GP discussion!

Post by Ducktanian »

I do wonder if theres going to be some kind of response from the drivers in regards to these issues, or what kind of response that would be.
Murray Walker: "A lot of people here are really debating whether Ricardo Rosset is Formula 1 material"
Martin Brundle: "Well, it's a fairly short debate, Murray".
User avatar
mario
Posts: 8091
Joined: 31 Oct 2009, 17:13

Re: 2021 Discussion Thread - Azerbaijan GP discussion!

Post by mario »

Ducktanian wrote:I do wonder if theres going to be some kind of response from the drivers in regards to these issues, or what kind of response that would be.

I hope that there is a sharp response, but I honestly wouldn't put it past the FIA to have hinted to the drivers that any such move would see them slapped with penalties for "bringing the sport into disrepute" in order to scare them off from that.
Martin Brundle, on watching a replay of Grosjean spinning:
"The problem with Grosjean is that he want to take a look back at the corner he's just exited"
User avatar
Ciaran
Posts: 300
Joined: 09 Mar 2015, 18:14

Re: 2021 Discussion Thread - Azerbaijan GP discussion!

Post by Ciaran »

dr-baker wrote:
Ciaran wrote:What's the point of a restart, we've got >90% of the race done FFS!

Hamilton making a mistake was the point of it. It ain't over till the chequered flag waves.

Yeah, I guess that'll teach me to shoot my mouth off. You could tell I was a tad salty about witnessing a potential deciding point in an 8th Hamilton title, and fearing that he was going to have another win fall into his lap by slipstreaming Perez at the end of L50.
Manager of Calsonic Team Impul in Formula E, K-Apex in PES & Eurasian F3 and Mitsuoka in Alt-F1 '76.
My career mode thread - 1988: AGS (19pts, 9th) // 1989: Arrows (25pts, 8th, 1 win!)
You'll never DNF if you always DNPQ. #RollSafe
User avatar
Bleu
Posts: 3388
Joined: 29 Mar 2009, 17:38

Re: 2021 Discussion Thread - Azerbaijan GP discussion!

Post by Bleu »

We'll see what happens if we have late safety car for non-dangerous incident, like Bahrain GP 2019.
User avatar
dinizintheoven
Posts: 3982
Joined: 09 Dec 2010, 01:24

Re: 2021 Discussion Thread - Azerbaijan GP discussion!

Post by dinizintheoven »

French driver hitches himself to Les Nouveaux Bleus in a move that will shock nobody...

...unless you thought that French driver was Pierre Gasly, who will presumably have to wait for a certain two-time World Champion to retire before he can make the same move, by which time he may have gone elsewhere.
James Allen, on his favourite F1 engine of all time:
"...the Life W12, I can't describe the noise to you, but imagine filling your dustbin with nuts and bolts, and then throwing it down the stairs, it was something akin to that!"
User avatar
Wallio
Site Donor
Site Donor
Posts: 2624
Joined: 22 Feb 2012, 22:54
Location: The Wyoming Valley, PA

Re: 2021 Discussion Thread - Azerbaijan GP discussion!

Post by Wallio »

dinizintheoven wrote:French driver hitches himself to Les Nouveaux Bleus in a move that will shock nobody...

...unless you thought that French driver was Pierre Gasly, who will presumably have to wait for a certain two-time World Champion to retire before he can make the same move, by which time he may have gone elsewhere.


Am I the only one who thinks this is a rather.......strange choice for Alpine, especially with who will be available in the next few silly seasons? I mean a one-year deal to bridge the new regs? Sure. But three years? For Ocon? That's certainly a choice.
Professional Historian/Retired Drag Racer/Whiskey Enthusiast

"He makes the move on the outside, and knowing George as we do, he's probably on the radio right now telling the team how great he is." - James Hinchcliffe on George Russell
User avatar
RAK
Posts: 964
Joined: 30 May 2009, 16:35

Re: 2021 Discussion Thread - Azerbaijan GP discussion!

Post by RAK »

Wallio wrote:
dinizintheoven wrote:French driver hitches himself to Les Nouveaux Bleus in a move that will shock nobody...

...unless you thought that French driver was Pierre Gasly, who will presumably have to wait for a certain two-time World Champion to retire before he can make the same move, by which time he may have gone elsewhere.


Am I the only one who thinks this is a rather.......strange choice for Alpine, especially with who will be available in the next few silly seasons? I mean a one-year deal to bridge the new regs? Sure. But three years? For Ocon? That's certainly a choice.


Considering that there isn't much to suggest that there's a wealth of talent among Formula 2 in general and less among their current F2 test driver - Zhou may be at the top of the Formula 2 Championship standings at the moment, but I can't say I rate him - Ocon would definitely represent a better choice for the seat than what they have coming down the pipeline.
Predicament Predictions Champion, 2011, 2018, 2019

They weren't the world's most competent team,
In fact, to be believed, their results must be seen,
Lola,
M-Mastercard Lola,
L, O, L, A, Lola!
User avatar
Wallio
Site Donor
Site Donor
Posts: 2624
Joined: 22 Feb 2012, 22:54
Location: The Wyoming Valley, PA

Re: 2021 Discussion Thread - Azerbaijan GP discussion!

Post by Wallio »

RAK wrote:
Wallio wrote:
dinizintheoven wrote:French driver hitches himself to Les Nouveaux Bleus in a move that will shock nobody...

...unless you thought that French driver was Pierre Gasly, who will presumably have to wait for a certain two-time World Champion to retire before he can make the same move, by which time he may have gone elsewhere.


Am I the only one who thinks this is a rather.......strange choice for Alpine, especially with who will be available in the next few silly seasons? I mean a one-year deal to bridge the new regs? Sure. But three years? For Ocon? That's certainly a choice.


Considering that there isn't much to suggest that there's a wealth of talent among Formula 2 in general and less among their current F2 test driver - Zhou may be at the top of the Formula 2 Championship standings at the moment, but I can't say I rate him - Ocon would definitely represent a better choice for the seat than what they have coming down the pipeline.


Very true, but is he better than Gasly, Kimi, Bottas, or Perez? I'd personally say no. All will be available next year, and Alpine certainly isn't shy about breaking the bank for drivers, so they could lure any one of those IMO. I suppose the devil you know is better and all that, but still.
Professional Historian/Retired Drag Racer/Whiskey Enthusiast

"He makes the move on the outside, and knowing George as we do, he's probably on the radio right now telling the team how great he is." - James Hinchcliffe on George Russell
User avatar
Rob Dylan
Posts: 3477
Joined: 18 May 2014, 15:34
Location: Andy Warhol's basement

Re: 2021 Discussion Thread - Azerbaijan GP discussion!

Post by Rob Dylan »

I must say I'm with Wallio on this one. Three years for Ocon? They must know something we don't. Either that or they've been taking Alonso's praise for the guy a little too much to heart, overreacted, and then gave him a three year contract!

I expect an article on Motorsport tomorrow about Alonso retracted all his positive statements about Esteban just out of jealousy that it wasn't him getting the extension :lol:
Murray Walker at the 1997 Austrian Grand Prix wrote:The other [Stewart] driver, who nobody's been paying attention to, because he's disappointing, is Jan Magnussen.
Felipe Nasr - the least forgettable F1 driver!
User avatar
Wallio
Site Donor
Site Donor
Posts: 2624
Joined: 22 Feb 2012, 22:54
Location: The Wyoming Valley, PA

Re: 2021 Discussion Thread - Azerbaijan GP discussion!

Post by Wallio »

Bottas: Claims chassis is damaged/defective.

Mercedes: Makes a big public show of switching chassis for FP1/2.

Crofty and Di Resta: Make snide comments and take the piss out of it all day.

Bottas: Goes P1 in FP1, and is only .008 off P1 in FP2.

Lewis: Goes slower and complains "there is something wrong with the car man."

Mercedes/Crofty/Di Resta: Shocked Pikachu Face
Professional Historian/Retired Drag Racer/Whiskey Enthusiast

"He makes the move on the outside, and knowing George as we do, he's probably on the radio right now telling the team how great he is." - James Hinchcliffe on George Russell
IceG
Posts: 681
Joined: 06 Oct 2011, 17:24
Location: London (the one in England)

Re: 2021 Discussion Thread - Azerbaijan GP discussion!

Post by IceG »

"In my personal opinion, as a driver, I would say first of all a tyre shouldn't fail depending on 1-2psi up or down on a certain pressure that Pirelli gives us." - Carlos Sainz

Absolutely.

“The pressures on the grid that were checked, were above the minimum. So yeah, I don't know what their expectations were. But I would imagine their expectations are that the pressure comes up. But that's exactly what happened with us.” - Otmar Szafnauer

I assume that Aston Martin have telemetry that supports what Szafnauer said and that it has been shared with the FIA and Pirelli. Even if the data is not from calibrated kit it must show the relative pressure changes.

Hope that the FIA put as much effort into monitoring and policing the tyre issue as they have with the bendy wings and track limits. Yes both of those things are important but tyre failures like those we saw at Baku are the sort of thing that surely everyone (drivers, teams, sponsors, TV and perhaps even Liberty) agrees must be fixed.
User avatar
Paul Hayes
Posts: 1101
Joined: 17 Apr 2009, 19:54

Re: 2021 Discussion Thread - Azerbaijan GP discussion!

Post by Paul Hayes »

That was another good one!

It was like a reversal of both Bahrain and Spain rolled into one. I had thought when the gap was stuck at five seconds for a while that Verstappen might not catch Hamilton, but in the end when he did get there the move was quite comfortable.

It feels rare that the action at the front towards the end means they don't get the chance to show passes further down the field in the last few laps!

Amazing and surprising after their recent races that Ferrari failed to score and finished well down.
User avatar
UncreativeUsername37
Posts: 3420
Joined: 25 May 2012, 14:36
Location: Earth

Re: 2021 Discussion Thread - Azerbaijan GP discussion!

Post by UncreativeUsername37 »

This is what two title contenders being so close does, it was a great race. And there was enough going on in the midfield that we weren't just waiting through a chasedown.
Rob Dylan wrote:Mercedes paying homage to the other W12 chassis by breaking down 30 minutes in
User avatar
Paul Hayes
Posts: 1101
Joined: 17 Apr 2009, 19:54

Re: 2021 Discussion Thread - Styrian GP discussion!

Post by Paul Hayes »

Not a bad little race - not the greatest, but plenty to hold the interest. It's becoming increasingly difficult to see Mercedes turning this around at this stage.

But still a long way to go, of course!
User avatar
mario
Posts: 8091
Joined: 31 Oct 2009, 17:13

Re: 2021 Discussion Thread - Styrian GP discussion!

Post by mario »

Paul Hayes wrote:Not a bad little race - not the greatest, but plenty to hold the interest. It's becoming increasingly difficult to see Mercedes turning this around at this stage.

But still a long way to go, of course!

I doubt they will, and instead think it's more likely that we'll just see Red Bull progressively walk away with this and Verstappen go on to dominate the majority of the upcoming races for the rest of this season.

The development restrictions on the engine and on the chassis, and a set of regulations that arguably don't really help out a low rake car like Mercedes - as cynically suggested by Grosjean, intentionally so - inhibit their ability to develop their way out, especially as the budget cap also restricts them on that front too.

The only real change that is occurring this season will be a changed tyre carcass - it seems that Pirelli was already planning to introduce another iteration on the current tyres (which is itself already a modified carcass), but is potentially accelerating those changes following Baku.

However, the speculation is that the changes might be more favourable for Red Bull (due to the side effect of reducing the compliance of the tyre sidewall), so that change might, if anything, give them more of an advantage.
Martin Brundle, on watching a replay of Grosjean spinning:
"The problem with Grosjean is that he want to take a look back at the corner he's just exited"
User avatar
Miguel98
Posts: 2450
Joined: 30 Mar 2014, 09:18
Location: Somewhere in Portugal

Re: 2021 Discussion Thread - Styrian GP discussion!

Post by Miguel98 »

Was I the only one that seemed a bit confused by how the Pirelli's behaved today? I know that the italian marque has been under fire recently, but I felt that today the tyres were a shambles in performance and degradation.
Mario on Gutierrez after the Italian Grand Prix wrote:He's no longer just a bit of a tool, he's the entire tool set.


18-07-2015: Forever in our hearts Jules.
25-08-2015: Forever in our hearts Justin.
IceG
Posts: 681
Joined: 06 Oct 2011, 17:24
Location: London (the one in England)

Re: 2021 Discussion Thread - Styrian GP discussion!

Post by IceG »

Miguel98 wrote:Was I the only one that seemed a bit confused by how the Pirelli's behaved today? I know that the italian marque has been under fire recently, but I felt that today the tyres were a shambles in performance and degradation.


No tyres blew up. There were only two punctures, both caused by collisions. I saw very little sliding or spinning related to tyre degradation. All three compounds were used during the race, each in predictable circumstances. The only radio comments from the drivers that I heard were about expected life compared to the pit-stop plans.

I thought Pirelli had a quiet weekend which meant we could obsess about engine oils, flexi-wings and robotised pit-stops instead.
User avatar
Enforcer
Site Donor
Site Donor
Posts: 1498
Joined: 31 Mar 2009, 20:09
Location: Ireland

Re: 2021 Discussion Thread - Styrian GP discussion!

Post by Enforcer »

So I see there's a lot of "buh, they're not being let battle!!!" after the Norris and Perez penalties. Gonna disagree there. Surely knowing that another driver can't push you out off the outside if you're alongside them is encouragement to try a move rather than discouragement?

Russell proved you can defend T6 without putting the other car right into the gravel (although he did psuh v. close to it), so why couldn't Perez?

I suppose the issue of how much overlap makes it illegal for you to be pushed out is not clearly defined.
IceG
Posts: 681
Joined: 06 Oct 2011, 17:24
Location: London (the one in England)

Re: 2021 Discussion Thread - Styrian GP discussion!

Post by IceG »

Enforcer wrote:So I see there's a lot of "buh, they're not being let battle!!!" after the Norris and Perez penalties.


I suspect we would not be having this conversation, nor would there have been penalties, had there been a nice smooth concrete run-off area. All those pebbles and that dust turn a nudge into a penalty.

It seems that, for the stewards at least, there is a choice between close tough racing with contact or track limits that actually have some effect when they are transgressed. Personally I saw nothing wrong with any of the overtakes and am in favour of gravel traps (or that surface they had in Paul Ricard) rather than run-off areas.
User avatar
Miguel98
Posts: 2450
Joined: 30 Mar 2014, 09:18
Location: Somewhere in Portugal

Re: 2021 Discussion Thread - Styrian GP discussion!

Post by Miguel98 »

Masi has explained the reasoning behind the Pérez and Norris penalties on Sunday.

https://www.autosport.com/f1/news/why-fia-is-unmoved-over-austrian-gp-penalty-criticism/6625956/

Now, I do understand the reasoning, even if I don't agree with the Lando penalty. He didn't exactly push Pérez wide - it was more a case of corner nature and, had Norris backed down, he would've lost the place. Pérez was also never ahead, so Norris was entitlled to that space anyway. Pérez was going for the "if gap, car" approach at that exact moment.

Of course, pushing wide should be penalized, but we've seen time and time again this happening and no penalties were given. Remember when Hamilton kept pushing Rosberg wide? When Nico did the same? Or Max Imola move? Now, taking to this, theres a very interesting quote on this news article that I find interesting:

"First corner, lap one, and you have to remember this from a team's perspective as well, that all lap one incidents are treated in a more lenient manner,” he said. “And that has been the case for a number of years under the let them race principles, let's call it.

“But each and every one, it's very difficult to try and compare. I know everyone likes to group everything, but it's very difficult to compare two completely different corners at Imola, and either Turns 4 or 6 here."



I find this interesting because, what is being said, is you can be as agressive as you wish on lap 1 basically. So why, over the years, have very agressive defensive moves (worse than what Norris did) - remember Verstappen's defensive maneuver on Kimi at Spa - mid-race been classified as "safe" and not penalizable?

And another thing. Norris move was on the SC restart. Wouldn't that technically account for lap one? We've seen SC restarts where similar moves happened - the only big difference is there was no gravel in the outside to punish the driver attempting the move. So, again: this whole grey area of stewarding goes unadressed and only causes more confusion and chaos once you analize it further.
Mario on Gutierrez after the Italian Grand Prix wrote:He's no longer just a bit of a tool, he's the entire tool set.


18-07-2015: Forever in our hearts Jules.
25-08-2015: Forever in our hearts Justin.
IceG
Posts: 681
Joined: 06 Oct 2011, 17:24
Location: London (the one in England)

Re: 2021 Discussion Thread - Styrian GP discussion!

Post by IceG »

Further to my comment above concerning the gravel's influence on the penalty decision...

https://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/why- ... m/6625949/

Now imagine that the outside of the turn in the Perez/Norris incident had been concrete run-off and Perez had driven around Norris. Would Perez not have had to give the place back for gaining an advantage by going off track?
User avatar
Miguel98
Posts: 2450
Joined: 30 Mar 2014, 09:18
Location: Somewhere in Portugal

Re: 2021 Discussion Thread - Styrian GP discussion!

Post by Miguel98 »

IceG wrote:Further to my comment above concerning the gravel's influence on the penalty decision...

https://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/why- ... m/6625949/

Now imagine that the outside of the turn in the Perez/Norris incident had been concrete run-off and Perez had driven around Norris. Would Perez not have had to give the place back for gaining an advantage by going off track?


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3rLADm9oM8M&ab_channel=F1Abordo

Check turn 1 and you have your answer
Mario on Gutierrez after the Italian Grand Prix wrote:He's no longer just a bit of a tool, he's the entire tool set.


18-07-2015: Forever in our hearts Jules.
25-08-2015: Forever in our hearts Justin.
IceG
Posts: 681
Joined: 06 Oct 2011, 17:24
Location: London (the one in England)

Re: 2021 Discussion Thread - Styrian GP discussion!

Post by IceG »

Miguel98 wrote:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3rLADm9oM8M&ab_channel=F1Abordo

Check turn 1 and you have your answer


QED except Norris regained the position on merit having not lost drive on the bumps. Had he not it might have been a matter for the stewards.
User avatar
mario
Posts: 8091
Joined: 31 Oct 2009, 17:13

Re: 2021 Discussion Thread - Styrian GP discussion!

Post by mario »

IceG wrote:
Miguel98 wrote:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3rLADm9oM8M&ab_channel=F1Abordo

Check turn 1 and you have your answer


QED except Norris regained the position on merit having not lost drive on the bumps. Had he not it might have been a matter for the stewards.

You would have thought that the stewards might step in if Perez had held onto the position after passing Norris at Turn 1. That said, if it was just a 5 second penalty, I would wager that Red Bull probably would have happily traded a 5 second penalty for Perez getting past Norris at that point, since he'd have had a chance of being able to pull out enough of a gap to hold the place anyway (plus the bonus of getting one more car ahead of Hamilton to widen the points gap even further).

I guess, though, that there is a certain irony in that Perez might not have been close enough to attempt that pass into Turn 4 if he'd not had that run up to Turn 3 that he got from going wide at Turn 1.
Martin Brundle, on watching a replay of Grosjean spinning:
"The problem with Grosjean is that he want to take a look back at the corner he's just exited"
User avatar
Rob Dylan
Posts: 3477
Joined: 18 May 2014, 15:34
Location: Andy Warhol's basement

Re: 2021 Discussion Thread - Styrian GP discussion!

Post by Rob Dylan »

Today's storm in a teacup comes from Daniel Ricciardo being caught on microphone that something or other was "terrible. It’s shite, it’s worse" when standing next to the new 2022 car.

I can only assume he was talking about the new season of his favourite tv show, but folks are blowing it up to "2022 is going to be terrible because Daniel says so!"
Murray Walker at the 1997 Austrian Grand Prix wrote:The other [Stewart] driver, who nobody's been paying attention to, because he's disappointing, is Jan Magnussen.
Felipe Nasr - the least forgettable F1 driver!
Alextrax52
Posts: 2943
Joined: 17 Apr 2013, 20:06
Location: Bromborough near Liverpool

Re: 2021 Discussion Thread - Styrian GP discussion!

Post by Alextrax52 »

It would sum up George Russell’s luck to an absolute tee if he finally finishes a race in the top 10 and yet only the first 3 get points and then finished 11th in the race where half the grid get points

Seriously though what are Mercedes waiting for? They can’t ignore this any longer. With Bottas again nowhere near the big two (yeah he’s being sacrificed but there’s a reason for that) I say get George in that car and Mercedes will be even stronger and it’ll give Hamilton something to think about
User avatar
CaptainGetz12
Site Donor
Site Donor
Posts: 1848
Joined: 06 Mar 2013, 03:19
Location: Sacramento, CA, USA
Contact:

Re: 2021 Discussion Thread - Styrian GP discussion!

Post by CaptainGetz12 »

Rob Dylan wrote:Today's storm in a teacup comes from Daniel Ricciardo being caught on microphone that something or other was "terrible. It’s shite, it’s worse" when standing next to the new 2022 car.

I can only assume he was talking about the new season of his favourite tv show, but folks are blowing it up to "2022 is going to be terrible because Daniel says so!"


Depends on the type of terrible. If it's lelrel, 2022 will be crazy. Anything but the dirty-air-laden cars of now.
Klon wrote:What did poor André do to you for him to be insulted like that?
IceG
Posts: 681
Joined: 06 Oct 2011, 17:24
Location: London (the one in England)

Re: 2021 Discussion Thread - Styrian GP discussion!

Post by IceG »

Ok this thread seems to be morphing into the British GP discussion thread so...

FP1. The Sky commentators going crazy about all the action being compressed into just one hour. And then Sky slip in two 4 minute ad breaks, both of which missed important laps. Solution was to replay limited highlights in slo-mo, so missing yet another important lap. This format cannot support ad breaks during FP1.

Sprint Qualy. I quite like the dynamics of having all the cars on the same tyre compound in all sessions. Seemed to improve the spectacle somehow. This could work with non-sprint weekends.

FP2. IIUC the cars are in parc ferme conditions so no changes except front wing, diff, tyres and petrol. There will be long runs for tyre deg at different petrol loads and perhaps some work on alternative tyre choices for the sprint race (they can use whatever tyres they want I think). So is FP2 has the potential to be nought but a snooze-fest.

Post FP2 update: what a tedious waste of time, tyres and fuel that was.
User avatar
Wallio
Site Donor
Site Donor
Posts: 2624
Joined: 22 Feb 2012, 22:54
Location: The Wyoming Valley, PA

Re: 2021 Discussion Thread - Styrian GP discussion!

Post by Wallio »

Rob Dylan wrote:Today's storm in a teacup comes from Daniel Ricciardo being caught on microphone that something or other was "terrible. It’s shite, it’s worse" when standing next to the new 2022 car.

I can only assume he was talking about the new season of his favourite tv show, but folks are blowing it up to "2022 is going to be terrible because Daniel says so!"



I mean if he was talking about that rainbow unicorn vomit livery they stuck on it, he's 100% right. It's amazing how much improved the car looked on Friday with all the teams releasing their own renders.
Professional Historian/Retired Drag Racer/Whiskey Enthusiast

"He makes the move on the outside, and knowing George as we do, he's probably on the radio right now telling the team how great he is." - James Hinchcliffe on George Russell
Post Reply