Your Reject of the Race - Australia!

DanielPT · Post by **DanielPT** » 27 Mar 2011, 14:52

James1978 wrote:Don't see the point of saying HRT for RotR - after all, I expect them to be similar to this in the coming races!

I agree. Besides they didn't even raced this weekend. It was somewhat like a test.

WIDD · Post by **WIDD** » 27 Mar 2011, 14:59

Are HRT even elligible given the basis they didn't actually make the race...? But for me has to be either the limitations on DRS that race control deicded, or Rubens. All weekend he was a disaster. Qualified 17th because he spun out, ran wide first lap losing a lot of time then smashed into Rosberg. Quality drive.

Enforcer · Post by **Enforcer** » 27 Mar 2011, 15:07

James1978 wrote:Don't see the point of saying HRT for RotR - after all, I expect them to be similar to this in the coming races!

I know that rejectworthiness is partially dependent on expectations - we're not going to award RotR to Timo Glock for failing to qualify higher than 21st, for example - but I'd make an exception on Hispania's part because they failed to qualify. That is the bare minimum that should be expected of any team in F1. So either:

1) Hispania are slow because they couldn't test and there's more to come from the car. That's no one's fault but their own.

2) The car is so limited that 1.7 seconds outside the 107% is its level. Again, no one's fault but their own.

Hence RotR nomination.

Blackmore · Post by **Blackmore** » 27 Mar 2011, 15:33

HRT. True rejects.

watka · Post by **watka** » 27 Mar 2011, 15:51

My top 3:

Dishonourable mention - Mark Webber
He wasn't completely useless, but he may as well walk around the paddock wearing a sandwich board saying "Red Bull no. 2" for the rest of the season. Whilst everyone was banging on about how close Webber was to Vettel last season and how unlucky he was to lose out on a number of occasions, he was well and truly stomped this weekend by Vettel.

3rd - HRT
They would be higher had I not been expecting them to not qualify! The car looks barely different from last year's car, and their driver choice is not exactly inspired either (no Klien?). A token effort to qualify at best.

2nd - Nick Heidfeld
Let's be honest, Nick was hired as team leader, not as an equal to Petrov. However he looked more like Nelson Piquet Jr out there than Robert Kubica. Qualifying was embarrassing and those who thought he was just unlucky during qualifying (including me) were proven wrong as he made no progress in the race. Petrov showed how fast the car could be, and clearly the car wasn't built around him, so what was Nick's problem?

1st - Williams
That's the way to cut 20% off the value of your shares in one day! Maldonado was pretty much nowhere all weekend long. He unfortunately retired, but even had he not, I'm not sure he would have beaten the Force India's to the points. Barrichello drove like a complete amateur, making a rookie mistake in both qualifying and the race. Not what you expect at all from F1's most experienced driver.

Aerond · Post by **Aerond** » 27 Mar 2011, 16:06

you can't blame liuzzi or kathikeyan for not qualifying a non tried car... They will do much better in malaysia me thinks.

I also don't like all you guys whining about drs... Drs is meant TO HELP overtaking not TO PRODUCE overaking by its own, and it did a fair good job on that. The race was pretty interesting with head to head battles over the field so I can't see why you guys complain that much. Overtaking was never easy, even on turbo era drivers complained on the precedent car producing turbulences and not being able to overtake so I don't know what the fuss is about. The new rule worked its way, its truth that a better area of the track could have been used but the fia will have noticed and from now on we will see the drs area placed better.

I nominate Barrichello as ROTR, I won't repeat the reasons as a couple of people have already written them.

dinizintheoven · Post by **dinizintheoven** » 27 Mar 2011, 16:34

Rather than nominate an actual ROTR (because we all know who is going to get it), I will just give an exceptionally dishonourable mention to Fondmetal Team Malaysia. How in the name of Archimedes' rusty bathplug have they managed to go absolutely nowhere? They've bought a gearbox and rear suspension from a race winning Red Bull, and a Renault engine, spent most of last season designing their second car that was supposed to get them into the brawl with Force India, Toro Rosso, Sauber and Williams... and for what? Nick Heidfeld, with a gruesomely rejectful Q1 performance to take 18th place and drop out in the first session, was as near as makes no difference two seconds behind Sebastian Vettel's fastest Q1 time... and Heikki Kovalainen, one place further back, was another two seconds behind him. On today's performance, they're no closer to taking on the midfield than they were with the T127, which had a Cosworth engine, an Xtrac gearbox, and was thrown together in a turnip shed in about five minutes. I really would not like to be Mike Gascoyne now, and I would like even less to be anyone within a mile radius of him.

I suppose, if there is any positivity to be had, hope springs eternal that this was a blip on the radar. It was said on the BBC commentary that the T128 has huge problems getting heat into the tyres, and this race was rather cold. Going to Sepang next, where it is always a million degrees and 5000% humidity, maybe they won't crash so badly. But at somewhere like Silverstone, it's going to be the same old story.

Dan B · Post by **Dan B** » 27 Mar 2011, 16:42

(Dis)honorable mentions:
- Mark Webber: Drove like a midfielder in the best car on the grid. Not having KERS might be part of it, but even then, Vettel took a commanding win.
- Jenson Button: Stop whining; cutting the corner to pass isn't legal.
- The FIA: For not being able to see Sauber's wing before the race. Come on; that should have been caught beforehand.
- Team Lotus: For the reasons posted above. Wasn't this car supposed to be battling the Williams, Saubers, and Force Indias?

3rd: HRT: Not surprising really, considering their sorta-2011 car.

2nd: Nick Heidfeld: Anonymous as ever. Trounced by Petrov in the same car too; granted, Speed Channel did mention that its KERS was not working and it did have damage. Still a rather poor drive.

1st: Williams, ESPECIALLY Rubens Barrichello: No reliability, Maldonado was slow, and Barrichello drove like a rookie. That accident with Rosberg was laughable at best. What happened to the dominant team of the 80s and 90s we used to know? And honestly, if Hulkenberg were with Williams today, I don't think he would have done better.

ADx_Wales · Post by **ADx_Wales** » 27 Mar 2011, 16:46

The Rules.
Just like a mexican finger trap, the more they fight against it, the more it restricts them.

Collieafc · Post by **Collieafc** » 27 Mar 2011, 16:58

The Chello - If it was the other way round in that accident, he would be shouting and throwing his steering wheel onto the track. Again.

However, I will refrain from critisising Formula Catflap for now as I dont think Albert Park is a good track to showcase it, due to a lack of any particular long straight for it to make a difference. Be better to judge it in Malaysia or China (esp with its uber long straight, if, IF it will make a difference, itll be there. "If" is the key word here)

fjackdaw · Post by **fjackdaw** » 27 Mar 2011, 16:59

Aerond wrote:I also don't like all you guys whining about drs... Drs is meant TO HELP overtaking not TO PRODUCE overaking by its own, and it did a fair good job on that. The race was pretty interesting with head to head battles over the field so I can't see why you guys complain that much. Overtaking was never easy, even on turbo era drivers complained on the precedent car producing turbulences and not being able to overtake so I don't know what the fuss is about. The new rule worked its way, its truth that a better area of the track could have been used but the fia will have noticed and from now on we will see the drs area placed better.

Exactly. There was none of this "dirty air" stuff with drivers not even getting close - the fact that Button was unable to get past Massa, for example, was purely down to race craft. He shouldn't be able to press a button and breeze past, he still has to fight for it.

GwilymJJames · Post by **GwilymJJames** » 27 Mar 2011, 17:22

Sauber - If the car is illegal, that's your fault.

jackanderton · Post by **jackanderton** » 27 Mar 2011, 17:25

One of the few good but genuinely good things about less common overtaking in Formula 1 is that it is actually significant when it happens. However, given that many of the cars are so close on track but for years couldn't get close enough to get past, the DRS is worth a go and seems to have assisted the cars to get closer. On other tracks I can see this being more pronounced.

Another thing you have to factor in is that there are so many points on offer that drivers are willing to take fewer risks and settle for achievable targets. In the past it was game on for all the drivers above 6th place to scrap for the chance for those hard to earn points. So you have caution married with the aero problems of not being able to pass.

Barrichello's lunge today is another reminder of the cost of throwing away a result, but in the past it would've been seen as easier to justify. Mansell used to do those sort of things as a routine.

Post by **mario** » 27 Mar 2011, 17:30

Valrys wrote:Heidfeld - getting thrashed by Petrov, of all people, isn't something you want happening, but he DID make a fantastic start to 12th, before being assaulted by someone and suffering massive damage to one of his sidepods (Adam Cooper tweeted about it, apparantly it looked like a bomb had gone off in his sidepod!)

He isn't exaggerating - the car looks like a right mess, and looking at the hole punched in the side, it's a surprise that he didn't have any terminal damage to his radiators or other equipment.

Looking at that, it's no wonder that he was struggling so much - if anything, I'm surprised that he didn't retire from the race altogether.

Priceless · Post by **Priceless** » 27 Mar 2011, 17:45

Just woke up - the race left me up until 5 AM (local time here).

Well... I think I agree with a number of the opinions posted here so far. Here is mine...

Dishonorable mentions:
Jenson Button - the way he cut the corner while attempting to pass Massa, and the subsequent drive-thru penalty. I think he'd make it past Massa anyway if he hadn't done that.
Felipe Massa - He's now in a position relative to Alonso similar to that of Barrichello relative to Schumacher in the early 2000's - and his recent performances, unfortunately, justify that.
Team Lotus - I still expect them to improve, they showed last year that they can, but I really thought they'd be closer to the midfield than they were for this first race - disappointing performance.

My candidates:
3rd: Nick Heidfeld - was anonymous, running in the confines of the lower midfield while Petrov drove brilliantly to his podium finish. (Edit: Didn't see that damage to his car in the live broadcast though - maybe he could have been better)
2nd: Rubens Barrichello - a weekend to forget. Qualifies 17th on his own error, then ruins Rosberg's race and his own with an... at least strange move.
1st: Hispania Racing - The first double DNQ on merit since MasterCard Lola. Much as this was expected, as many people pointed out already... but even so, this is über-rejectful, I think.

WIDD · Post by **WIDD** » 27 Mar 2011, 17:56

mario wrote: He isn't exaggerating - the car looks like a right mess, and looking at the hole punched in the side, it's a surprise that he didn't have any terminal damage to his radiators or other equipment.

Looking at that, it's no wonder that he was struggling so much - if anything, I'm surprised that he didn't retire from the race altogether.

Does anyone know what the hell happened to that, for some reason I'm suspicious of Barrichello, Alguersuari or Buemi!

FullMetalJack · Post by **FullMetalJack** » 27 Mar 2011, 17:59

mario wrote:Looking at that, it's no wonder that he was struggling so much - if anything, I'm surprised that he didn't retire from the race altogether.

I'm not surprised he didn't retire, because it's Nick Heidfeld. He wants to keep up his reiability record.

pablo_h · Post by **pablo_h** » 27 Mar 2011, 17:59

watka wrote:My top 3:

Dishonourable mention - Mark Webber
He wasn't completely useless, but he may as well walk around the paddock wearing a sandwich board saying "Red Bull no. 2" for the rest of the season. Whilst everyone was banging on about how close Webber was to Vettel last season and how unlucky he was to lose out on a number of occasions, he was well and truly stomped this weekend by Vettel.

He has no.2 on his hat FFS. Last year was a race to prove who is no.1 and no.2, and webber lost. He is no.2 at RBR now, it's a given. Not going to make excuses for him, but he lost to Hamilton at the start because hami had KERS and he didn't, and then got lost in traffic and had a bad race. If either KERS wasn't legal, or RBR had KERS, it may have been an RBR 1-2. But still, not defending the average drive by Webber, Vettel dominated. I'm just saying Webber had no.2 on his hat, he is no.2 and that's how this season will go for him. A Webber WDC will never happen, he'll just spend this year in support and trying to get podiums, and maybe a win if Vettel's WDC is safe. Webber is going to be a uber no.2 driver, the best you've seen. He's been beaten like Massa right now and just going to cruise for the year. Get the money, get some fast laps and some points, then retire.

Ross Prawn · Post by **Ross Prawn** » 27 Mar 2011, 18:05

James1978 wrote:Don't see the point of saying HRT for RotR - after all, I expect them to be similar to this in the coming races!

Maybe we should just give HRT ROTY now, and nominate others for the rest of the races.

watka · Post by **watka** » 27 Mar 2011, 18:07

pablo_h wrote:
watka wrote:My top 3:

Dishonourable mention - Mark Webber
He wasn't completely useless, but he may as well walk around the paddock wearing a sandwich board saying "Red Bull no. 2" for the rest of the season. Whilst everyone was banging on about how close Webber was to Vettel last season and how unlucky he was to lose out on a number of occasions, he was well and truly stomped this weekend by Vettel.

He has no.2 on his hat FFS. Last year was a race to prove who is no.1 and no.2, and webber lost. He is no.2 at RBR now, it's a given. Not going to make excuses for him, but he lost to Hamilton at the start because hami had KERS and he didn't, and then got lost in traffic and had a bad race. If either KERS wasn't legal, or RBR had KERS, it may have been an RBR 1-2. But still, not defending the average drive by Webber, Vettel dominated. I'm just saying Webber had no.2 on his hat, he is no.2 and that's how this season will go for him.

Of course he has no. 2 on his car and all that but what I'm saying is he clearly doesn't want to be number 2 in the team, but that performance would have done nothing to convince the team to back him over Vettel.

Yannick · Post by **Yannick** » 27 Mar 2011, 19:23

Yannick wrote: Hence, my nominee so far is Veteran Drivers: Barrichello? Parked it. Heidfeld? Parked it, too. Schumacher? Well, P11 probably isn't exactly what he would have wished for. Webber? Beaten by his teammate. And yes, you could include Liuzzi and Karthikeyan in this argumentation as well because they are not exactly like young guns either are they?

Well, sadly, the Veteran Drivers haven't exactly covered themselves in glory in the race either. Barrichello shunted out Rosberg, Webber and Heidfeld were dominated by their teammates. And Schumacher parked it. The one thing probably all of them want now is to move on to the next race - quickly.

Warren Hughes · Post by **Warren Hughes** » 27 Mar 2011, 22:21

Having only seen the race, Barrichello is runaway ROTR for me.

Nessafox · Post by **Nessafox** » 27 Mar 2011, 22:26

Barichello

(hrt did actually better than theoretically possible, but they'll get roty probably)

fjackdaw · Post by **fjackdaw** » 27 Mar 2011, 23:23

If it weren't for the fact that Massa's birthday is a few weeks off and he remains stubbornly 29, my vote would be revised to The Over 30s. It's a young man's game.

noisebox · Post by **noisebox** » 27 Mar 2011, 23:48

All the F1 journos who spent hours speculating (wrongly) about the mythical Red Bull start only KERS...

Oh, and Mark Webber who was very poor all weekend.

FMecha · Post by **FMecha** » 28 Mar 2011, 04:49

Simply put.

HRT.

All HRTs DNQ'ed? Let's see if they can improve next race.

Captain Hammer · Post by **Captain Hammer** » 28 Mar 2011, 08:13

Dan B wrote:- The FIA: For not being able to see Sauber's wing before the race. Come on; that should have been caught beforehand.

You can't blame them - there's no scruitineering checks before the race. It simply takes too long to do it all. The race finished at 7pm, and the cars were submitted to scruitineering shortly afterwards. The disqualification came just before midnight local time. It takes at least six hours to check all the cars thoroughly.

There is a scruitineering check on Thursday once the cars have arrived. It's a detailed check of the entire vehicle, and it usually takes them all day to clear the cars. Then there are minor checks throughout the weekend, usually for weight. They don't do scruitineering throughout the weekend because it takes too long, and the teams need to work on the cars (once scruitineering begins, teams are not allowed to hold onto their cars). And they are allowed to put new bodywork pieces onto the cars as they go. There is then one final check after the race to make sure no-one slipped any performance-enhancing pieces onto the cars.

The only reason why people are upset about Sauber failing scruitineering is because Perez had a great debut and Kobayashi scored points. If they had finished 11th and 12th, there wouldn't be nearly as much uproar.

Salamander · Post by **Salamander** » 28 Mar 2011, 08:18

I think I'll change my nomination to Sauber's rear wing, unless their appeal goes through, which I sadly doubt.

Captain Hammer · Post by **Captain Hammer** » 28 Mar 2011, 09:08

mario wrote:Looking at that, it's no wonder that he was struggling so much - if anything, I'm surprised that he didn't retire from the race altogether.

But at the same time, Petrov made him look like ... well, Petrov al weekend.

DanielPT · Post by **DanielPT** » 28 Mar 2011, 09:25

Captain Hammer wrote:
mario wrote:Looking at that, it's no wonder that he was struggling so much - if anything, I'm surprised that he didn't retire from the race altogether.

But at the same time, Petrov made him look like ... well, Petrov al weekend.

Well, perhaps Heidfeld can do better in the next race with a bit more luck. Being trounced by Petrov is not a presentation card you would want to have...

Captain Hammer · Post by **Captain Hammer** » 28 Mar 2011, 10:49

If Petrov can keep his Melbourne performance up throughout the year, that's not going to be as bad a thing as it once was.

Python · Post by **Python** » 28 Mar 2011, 12:05

While I would nominate HRT mainly because they didn't qualify that seems like a cop-out answer so I am going to with Sauber on this one. They should have known that the wing wasn't legal to being with.

James1978 · Post by **James1978** » 28 Mar 2011, 13:00

Trying to think which drivers are over 30 - Webber (I'd say he was more of a dead beat teammate than a reject), Button (for that move), Schumacher (not really his fault but he missed Q3), Heidfeld (looks bad but I think it's too early to write him off just yet), Barrichello (ha!), Trulli (didn;t even notice Lotus were there to be honest!), and Karthikeyan (he was something like 2s off Liuzzi wasn't he????) :lol:

S951 · Post by **S951** » 28 Mar 2011, 13:02

Karun for me, we all knew hrt would be off the pace and just "special" but binning it into the wall within 5min of practice bravo!

Also must put this up, I know Nick should not have got into the position in the first place and qualified better than he did yes kers wasn't working and he got blocked but he did make a few mistakes on that lap anyway having this in the race didn't help his pace at all

BOOM

Ed24 · Post by **Ed24** » 28 Mar 2011, 14:02

Nominees:
Button/McLaren: Should have known to give back position after so many past examples of similar moves being penalised. Also, they blamed each other for not deciding to let Massa through. Button also tried to blame Massa for good defending.
HRT: Obvious reasons.
Webber: Parking the car just after the finish line for no obvious mechanical reason was embarrassing and immature.
Pre-season testing form guide

Winner/Loser:
Barrichello: If you didn't know better, you would think that Maldonado had put on Barrichello's helmet. Wasted his qualifying opportunity, went off on Lap 1 with some poor track positioning, and then a lack of judgement in his move on Rosberg. Age may be starting to get the better of him unfortunately.

AndreaModa · Post by **AndreaModa** » 28 Mar 2011, 22:40

It hurts me to say it but Williams can walk away with ROTR this time round in my book, though Heidfeld and Schumacher push him close, both despite the fact they had damage, still had awful weekends and should do better.

Tealy · Post by **Tealy** » 29 Mar 2011, 15:30

DanielPT wrote:
Captain Hammer wrote:
mario wrote:Looking at that, it's no wonder that he was struggling so much - if anything, I'm surprised that he didn't retire from the race altogether.

But at the same time, Petrov made him look like ... well, Petrov al weekend.

Well, perhaps Heidfeld can do better in the next race with a bit more luck. Being trounced by Petrov is not a presentation card you would want to have...

Definitely, I think the next race or two will be crucial to his season. he absolutely must get at least close to Petrov if not in front of him or his reputation will suffer. To be honest I expect Heidfeld to improve massively on Australia but if Petrov can keep his speed up I don't see Heidfeld catching him.

FullMetalJack · Post by **FullMetalJack** » 29 Mar 2011, 20:39

Tealy wrote:Definitely, I think the next race or two will be crucial to his season. he absolutely must get at least close to Petrov if not in front of him or his reputation will suffer. To be honest I expect Heidfeld to improve massively on Australia but if Petrov can keep his speed up I don't see Heidfeld catching him.

This could be Merc 2010 all over again. Although Nick was racing the last 5 races of 2010.

rffp · Post by **rffp** » 29 Mar 2011, 20:59

My pick is for the guy I root for: Rubens Barrichello and his over-optmistic attempt of passing Rosberg.
Honorable mention to Felipe Massa and another souless drive as he paves his way out of Ferrari.

nome66 · Post by **nome66** » 30 Mar 2011, 10:23

My reject of the race? Is that even a question? Easy.

Sauber. They got bit by the rules, plus no one I have talked to in person before the race (we watched it on TV) said they thought saber would get a podium finish.