The HRT thread

Jeroen Krautmeir · Post by **Jeroen Krautmeir** » 17 Apr 2011, 09:07

DanielPT wrote:I am actually please in the way this HRT car is turning out. At least it qualifies so that is a good thing. They are still lacking the pace to beat the Virgins but they will eventually get there. It certainly looks like a modern F1 car!

I really hope a sponsor hops onboard with HRT. They can beat Virgin, no doubt about it, but they don't have enough cash at the moment.

DanielPT · Post by **DanielPT** » 17 Apr 2011, 09:15

Jeroen Krautmeir wrote:
DanielPT wrote:I am actually please in the way this HRT car is turning out. At least it qualifies so that is a good thing. They are still lacking the pace to beat the Virgins but they will eventually get there. It certainly looks like a modern F1 car!

I really hope a sponsor hops onboard with HRT. They can beat Virgin, no doubt about it, but they don't have enough cash at the moment.

Some say they are being financed by Mr. E with the purpose of undermining the teams/FOTA position when concorde agreement negotiations come along. I hope they get more cash from their own and stop having a godfather.

Phoenix · Post by **Phoenix** » 17 Apr 2011, 11:49

BlindCaveSalamander wrote:
Phoenix wrote:
DanielPT wrote:
I think he means a really acute case. One in which the subject isn't great even in the midfield. He only surpasses himself at the back of the grid.

But that's not fisichellitis, that's a mild case of rejectfulness.

Well, Fisichellaitis is just a mild form of rejectfulness in and of itself.

No, fisichellaitis is a form of underperformance, just like other malaises such as toyotaitis, which is the most acute case ever studied by the science.

Valrys · Post by **Valrys** » 17 Apr 2011, 12:46

Apparently Liuzzi was running with the finless engine cover during the race, while Narain was using the original. Wonder if that gave him any advantage?

JGomezHRT · Post by **JGomezHRT** » 17 Apr 2011, 14:20

Yes, new engine cover only for Liuzzi

Warren Hughes · Post by **Warren Hughes** » 17 Apr 2011, 14:31

Did anyone see Tonio's (or at least I think it was Tonio) "what is Deletraz doing" moment down the back straight about two-thirds through the race? My Dad, brother and I had a good laugh about it at the time (and I'm the only F1rejects inductee among the 3 of us)

Waris · Post by **Waris** » 17 Apr 2011, 15:03

JGomezHRT wrote:Yes, new engine cover only for Liuzzi

Way to cut the number in half like that...

patrick · Post by **patrick** » 17 Apr 2011, 15:35

Warren Hughes wrote:Did anyone see Tonio's (or at least I think it was Tonio) "what is Deletraz doing" moment down the back straight about two-thirds through the race? My Dad, brother and I had a good laugh about it at the time (and I'm the only F1rejects inductee among the 3 of us)

Yeah I spotted that, had a good chuckle. Warming up the tyres?

Valrys · Post by **Valrys** » 17 Apr 2011, 17:40

patrick wrote:
Warren Hughes wrote:Did anyone see Tonio's (or at least I think it was Tonio) "what is Deletraz doing" moment down the back straight about two-thirds through the race? My Dad, brother and I had a good laugh about it at the time (and I'm the only F1rejects inductee among the 3 of us)

Yeah I spotted that, had a good chuckle. Warming up the tyres?

I noticed that as well, and yes, of course, my first thought was Deletraz

I also read someone suggesting that this was a good thing, as obviously the Hispania is SO easy on its tyres, they have to push extra hard to get heat into them! :lol:

watka · Post by **watka** » 17 Apr 2011, 20:45

Valrys wrote:
patrick wrote:
Warren Hughes wrote:Did anyone see Tonio's (or at least I think it was Tonio) "what is Deletraz doing" moment down the back straight about two-thirds through the race? My Dad, brother and I had a good laugh about it at the time (and I'm the only F1rejects inductee among the 3 of us)

Yeah I spotted that, had a good chuckle. Warming up the tyres?

I noticed that as well, and yes, of course, my first thought was Deletraz

I also read someone suggesting that this was a good thing, as obviously the Hispania is SO easy on its tyres, they have to push extra hard to get heat into them!

I noticed this too!

S951 · Post by **S951** » 18 Apr 2011, 16:28

the car in front looks better

Post by **mario** » 18 Apr 2011, 16:45

S951 wrote:

the car in front looks better

For now, yes - however, Auto Motor Und Sport has an interview with Timo Glock, where he discusses the upgrade package that Virgin Racing have in the works for Turkey - it's virtually a B-spec car. Wirth is planning on bringing a new raised nosecone, floor, exhaust layout and diffuser, new front and rear wings and a modified rear suspension layout, and is hoping that the MVR-02 should gain about two seconds a lap as a result. http://translate.google.co.uk/translate ... 40220.html
If Wirth is able to deliver on that promise, and the MVR-02 gains that amount of time, then HRT are probably going to end up back behind the Virgin Racing team, unless they can find a similar performance improvement over the next few races.

AndreaModa · Post by **AndreaModa** » 18 Apr 2011, 17:33

mario wrote:the upgrade package that Virgin Racing have in the works for Turkey - it's virtually a B-spec car. Wirth is planning on bringing a new raised nosecone, floor, exhaust layout and diffuser, new front and rear wings and a modified rear suspension layout, and is hoping that the MVR-02 should gain about two seconds a lap as a result.

Now that is Good News!

S951 · Post by **S951** » 18 Apr 2011, 18:35

bloody hell mario thats a fair bit of change there!! Now if they do gain 2 seconds it will be interesting as will show cfd working fine but christ they could of started with a better base, still with hrt if they manage to keep to their development plan and understand the setup aswell as they did last year they will be last but not stone dead last

KL-racer · Post by **KL-racer** » 18 Apr 2011, 18:39

mario wrote:
S951 wrote:

the car in front looks better

For now, yes - however, Auto Motor Und Sport has an interview with Timo Glock, where he discusses the upgrade package that Virgin Racing have in the works for Turkey - it's virtually a B-spec car. Wirth is planning on bringing a new raised nosecone, floor, exhaust layout and diffuser, new front and rear wings and a modified rear suspension layout, and is hoping that the MVR-02 should gain about two seconds a lap as a result. http://translate.google.co.uk/translate ... 40220.html
If Wirth is able to deliver on that promise, and the MVR-02 gains that amount of time, then HRT are probably going to end up back behind the Virgin Racing team, unless they can find a similar performance improvement over the next few races.

Well, if Virgin would be able to gain 2 seconds next race, it would be amazing for them! But is this going to be enough to beat team lotus for 10th? I don't think so!

dinizintheoven · Post by **dinizintheoven** » 18 Apr 2011, 19:58

Warren Hughes wrote:Did anyone see Tonio's (or at least I think it was Tonio) "what is Deletraz doing" moment down the back straight about two-thirds through the race? My Dad, brother and I had a good laugh about it at the time (and I'm the only F1rejects inductee among the 3 of us)

Yes - if only briefly. And by looking at this thread, now I know it was Liuzzi doing it. He'll be racing under a Swiss flag before we know it.

mario wrote:For now, yes - however, Auto Motor Und Sport has an interview with Timo Glock, where he discusses the upgrade package that Virgin Racing have in the works for Turkey - it's virtually a B-spec car. Wirth is planning on bringing a new raised nosecone, floor, exhaust layout and diffuser, new front and rear wings and a modified rear suspension layout, and is hoping that the MVR-02 should gain about two seconds a lap as a result. http://translate.google.co.uk/translate ... 40220.html
If Wirth is able to deliver on that promise, and the MVR-02 gains that amount of time, then HRT are probably going to end up back behind the Virgin Racing team, unless they can find a similar performance improvement over the next few races.

Yorkshire! Yorkshire! Yorkshire! *coughrussiacough*Yorkshire! Yorkshire! (etc)

Walsh_e · Post by **Walsh_e** » 18 Apr 2011, 20:43

KL-racer wrote:
mario wrote:
S951 wrote:

the car in front looks better

For now, yes - however, Auto Motor Und Sport has an interview with Timo Glock, where he discusses the upgrade package that Virgin Racing have in the works for Turkey - it's virtually a B-spec car. Wirth is planning on bringing a new raised nosecone, floor, exhaust layout and diffuser, new front and rear wings and a modified rear suspension layout, and is hoping that the MVR-02 should gain about two seconds a lap as a result. http://translate.google.co.uk/translate ... 40220.html
If Wirth is able to deliver on that promise, and the MVR-02 gains that amount of time, then HRT are probably going to end up back behind the Virgin Racing team, unless they can find a similar performance improvement over the next few races.

Well, if Virgin would be able to gain 2 seconds next race, it would be amazing for them! But is this going to be enough to beat team lotus for 10th? I don't think so!

Maybe not, but at the moment it would probably be enough to beat Williams to it.

Post by **mario** » 19 Apr 2011, 14:56

S951 wrote:bloody hell mario thats a fair bit of change there!! Now if they do gain 2 seconds it will be interesting as will show cfd working fine but christ they could of started with a better base, still with hrt if they manage to keep to their development plan and understand the setup aswell as they did last year they will be last but not stone dead last

If they can get everything ready and working in Turkey, it should add up to a very substantial difference in performance - they need to increase their downforce levels substantially, since they are really struggling at the moment to eke any more performance out of the car in its current configuration. However, whether they can get everything to work properly immediately is another matter.

Last year, when a number of teams introduced their versions of a blown diffuser, several of them hit problems - McLaren and Mercedes had a few problems with localised heat build up (warping floors due to thermal expansion and localised burning of bodywork), and Williams had a few problems with burning bodywork in China, which is why they ditched the blown diffuser they'd used in practise for the Malaysian spec floor. It's a substantial change to make to the diffuser and exhaust layout, and given that it is a very difficult environment to model (since you have to factor in the airflow from the bodywork in front, hot air from the cooling systems, turbulent air from the tyres etc.), it might take more than one attempt to perfect.
That said, I expect that Geoff Willis is not exactly hanging around - there have been a few rumours that he is working on a major upgrade package, which seems to be scheduled for around the Monaco GP. Glock himself said that they Virgin Racing needed to bring in a major upgrade package to avoid slipping behind HRT; considering that HRT could make big gains just through set up work, adding a major upgrade on top of that could present Virgin Racing with a real challenge.

As for why these upgrades are coming in now, and were not in place earlier. Perhaps part of the reason has simply been that Virgin Racing have been tied up with their hydraulics system - they seem to have got to grips with the Xtrac transmission now, but resolving its problems seem to have taken up a fair bit of time and effort. Secondly, we know that Nick Wirth's company have been overhauling their CFD capabilities recently, and it's probably the case that only now are they able to significantly increase the amount of effort and design iterations that they can do.
And another reason why the updates may be coming more rapidly is because Joe Saward has posted a few comments about recent restructuring by the teams - where he notes that Virgin Racing had raised a few complaints about Wirth and his technical team. It's amazing how much harder you can focus on something when you fear that your job is on the line...

GroupLotusRenault · Post by **GroupLotusRenault** » 20 Apr 2011, 07:57

Mario what kind of updates are HRT doing towards the car? Isnt the F111 just an updated F110?

DanielPT · Post by **DanielPT** » 20 Apr 2011, 15:32

mario wrote:the upgrade package that Virgin Racing have in the works for Turkey - it's virtually a B-spec car. Wirth is planning on bringing a new raised nosecone, floor, exhaust layout and diffuser, new front and rear wings and a modified rear suspension layout, and is hoping that the MVR-02 should gain about two seconds a lap as a result.

That would certainly be a welcome improvement. Virgin is nowhere near its expectations and that is perhaps why they are stirring up the design team. I personally don't agree with this since the CFD project and its team are still young and there are absolutely nothing to be gained from eventual changes at this point. I say to give them another year. About the parts, given that description I would say that they have enough to make it work and correspond to Glock and Wirth expectations, if they make them work, obviously.

Walsh_e wrote:Maybe not, but at the moment it would probably be enough to beat Williams to it.

It would be the mother of all humiliations if Williams would to slip further behind. Losing their place to some of these new teams. They seem to be barely ahead of Lotus in pure pace and those changes to the team cannot come soon enough. Sure, Williams may not have the budget or the appeal they had a decade ago, but still they have massive F1 experience in their ranks. And being beaten by the new teams would be really bad for their business. I hope they can bouce back and avoid such things. I wonder if HRT might pull it off one day though... :roll:

Peter · Post by **Peter** » 20 Apr 2011, 23:38

GroupLotusRenault wrote:Mario what kind of updates are HRT doing towards the car? Isnt the F111 just an updated F110?

As stated by Kolles and evidently, its almost a completely new car on the inside and outside.

Anyway, in response to Virgins major upgrades coming onboard, HRT will fall behind, until they themselves bring forth their major upgrades. After that, Williams will probably be in stone dead last :lol:

Seriously, Williams is a different story, I think its only the characteristics of Malaysia and China, which are very similar, that aren't fitting the car. I remember in Australia, Rubens was charging through the field up to his collision with Rosberg. That was probably a better example of their true pace than the past 2 races.

jpm · Post by **jpm** » 27 Apr 2011, 17:36

In Murray Walker's Vblog on the BBC, he calls Kolles a "top notch" team boss. Hmm, not sure about that one Muzza!

FullMetalJack · Post by **FullMetalJack** » 27 Apr 2011, 18:43

jpm wrote:In Murray Walker's Vblog on the BBC, he calls Kolles a "top notch" team boss. Hmm, not sure about that one Muzza!

That is obviously a prophecy that immediately turned out to be wrong.

Peter · Post by **Peter** » 28 Apr 2011, 14:54

jpm wrote:In Murray Walker's Vblog on the BBC, he calls Kolles a "top notch" team boss. Hmm, not sure about that one Muzza!

Well, considering he kept a team up and running with less money and facilities than a shoebox, he's the best team principal since Paul Stoddart and Eddie Jordan.

DanielPT · Post by **DanielPT** » 28 Apr 2011, 15:31

Peter wrote:
jpm wrote:In Murray Walker's Vblog on the BBC, he calls Kolles a "top notch" team boss. Hmm, not sure about that one Muzza!

Well, considering he kept a team up and running with less money and facilities than a shoebox, he's the best team principal since Paul Stoddart and Eddie Jordan.

On top of all that, he insists in not going home...

Phoenix · Post by **Phoenix** » 28 Apr 2011, 21:30

DanielPT wrote:
Peter wrote:
jpm wrote:In Murray Walker's Vblog on the BBC, he calls Kolles a "top notch" team boss. Hmm, not sure about that one Muzza!

Well, considering he kept a team up and running with less money and facilities than a shoebox, he's the best team principal since Paul Stoddart and Eddie Jordan.

On top of all that, he insists in not going home...

Go to your motorhome, Colin Kolles.

Does HRT have a motorhome?

DanielPT · Post by **DanielPT** » 29 Apr 2011, 08:51

Phoenix wrote:
Go to your motorhome, Colin Kolles.

Does HRT have a motorhome?

Yes. This:

MaxZero · Post by **MaxZero** » 29 Apr 2011, 11:49

Vijay Mallaya praised Kolles for running a small team very well when he shifted the teams management about after the '08 season. He may be a running joke here but he is considers competent at what he does, keeps the team in the news right enough

David AGS · Post by **David AGS** » 30 Apr 2011, 09:07

Here they come, they signed a sponsor!!!

Base Batteries, from India. 3 year deal too. I looked on their website, their logo looks good!!

http://www.pitpass.com/fes_php/pitpass_ ... t_id=43454

Yannick · Post by **Yannick** » 30 Apr 2011, 11:58

Kolles is obviously an expert at running a small team on a small budget and knows about the dangers of the tail end of the field. He has proven that he is an expert at saving a team when he did just that with Spyker and Force 1ndia.

For that kind of team, which HRT undoubtedly is at the moment, he did a better job than Eddie Jordan and Aguri Suzuki were able to do for their own teams because it was them who had to sell or close up shop.
Yet, Eddie Jordan has proven with his own team that he knows how to get a midfield team into a Top 4 team and a dark horse for the win. The latter is more than can be said of David Richards' ProDrive organisation and of Toyota's Grand Prix Engineering division (!)
So if the owners of HRT clearly picked the right successor for Adrian Campos whose main achievement it was to broker the Dallara deal and get the team the basis to start working from in the form of a car.

Even though I'm a fan of Timo Glock's driving, I hope that HRT can outscore Virgin Manor this season yet again, maybe only so that Timo and his manager look for a cockpit elsewhere.

Pointrox · Post by **Pointrox** » 30 Apr 2011, 12:02

David AGS wrote:Here they come, they signed a sponsor!!!

Base Batteries, from India. 3 year deal too. I looked on their website, their logo looks good!!

http://www.pitpass.com/fes_php/pitpass_ ... t_id=43454

And goes well with HRT's livery

I'm glad to hear the good news about HRT - maybe they will slowly start to fill the blanks on their car with some valuable sponsors and hopefully - with their money, Mercedes' wind-tunnel and Willis' experience - will be outdriving both Virgins on a regular basis or even close the gap to the Lotuses.
Wishful thinking

jackanderton · Post by **jackanderton** » 30 Apr 2011, 13:56

I do find it continually amazing. Usually the ermm... effluent just snowballs. No-one wants to be associated with bad news. USF1 recently just had that written all over it.

Now the team are just about set for the season, surely the main aim is getting some investment somewhere. Virgin and Renault managed to find investment from Russia for example, and Williams from Venezuela. Time to get creative.
They just don't really have an attractive brand and are not seen as a team with a particular style or point. They're improving that slowly but they need to hurry up as it really does make a big difference.

I really think that a plain livery would look more attractive to investors than 'YOUR LOGO HERE'.

DanielPT · Post by **DanielPT** » 30 Apr 2011, 19:11

David AGS wrote:Here they come, they signed a sponsor!!!

Base Batteries, from India. 3 year deal too. I looked on their website, their logo looks good!!

http://www.pitpass.com/fes_php/pitpass_ ... t_id=43454

Those are good news. Hope that it is the first of many. obviously having Narain was a big plus. I wonder if they can find some italian sponsors...

dinizintheoven · Post by **dinizintheoven** » 01 May 2011, 14:44

...surely some Spanish sponsors would be appropriate, or are they all swarming entirely round MotoGP?

Post by **mario** » 01 May 2011, 15:49

dinizintheoven wrote:...surely some Spanish sponsors would be appropriate, or are they all swarming entirely round MotoGP?

I'd assume that they'd be more interested in MotoGP, especially following Jorge Lorenzo's title in 2010 and the fact that Pedrosa, a fellow compatriot, is currently his biggest rival for the title this year. After that, I'd guess that Alonso would be the next biggest centre of attention in the Spanish motorsport world, with HRT given a minor billing. That said, HRT don't really have much of an identity that links them with Spain - yes, their name refers to Spain, Carabantes owns the team and they race under a Spanish racing licence, but almost all of the actual day to day operations are run by Kolles out of his facilities in Cologne, and a fair chunk of their team is Anglo-German, not Spanish.

In fact, beyond the image of "heroically struggling on", HRT really doesn't have that much of an identity, does it? With Team Lotus, you have a clear idea what Fernandes wants to achieve, whilst Virgin Racing at least can claim that Wirth's pure CFD approach is attempting to break beyond the traditional restrictions of the sport. But HRT? What do they stand for - because, at the moment, it doesn't seem clear what HRT's personality or ethos actually is.

Peter · Post by **Peter** » 02 May 2011, 02:38

Hallelujah F1 rejects works on my computer again

. No more struggling on my phone.

Anyway, unsurprising to see HRT get sponsors. They're if anything faster than they ever were and are actually able to run close to everyone else on pace, and will only get better. Good investment

GroupLotusRenault · Post by **GroupLotusRenault** » 02 May 2011, 08:18

Their car is really good though, the team sadly lacks the imaigne say like Lotus, virgin or Williams. They need a new team name, but the car liveary is nice.

SuperAguri · Post by **SuperAguri** » 02 May 2011, 08:23

David AGS wrote:Here they come, they signed a sponsor!!!

Base Batteries, from India. 3 year deal too. I looked on their website, their logo looks good!!

http://www.pitpass.com/fes_php/pitpass_ ... t_id=43454

I was in stitches when I read the title "Hispania sign a sponsor!". What is the betting that if they get a few more DNQs it will be "Hispania lose their sponsor!". :mrgreen:

HRT for me do not have the charm of the 90s new teams like Pacific or Forti.

GroupLotusRenault · Post by **GroupLotusRenault** » 02 May 2011, 08:35

SuperAguri wrote:
David AGS wrote:Here they come, they signed a sponsor!!!

Base Batteries, from India. 3 year deal too. I looked on their website, their logo looks good!!

http://www.pitpass.com/fes_php/pitpass_ ... t_id=43454

I was in stitches when I read the title "Hispania sign a sponsor!". What is the betting that if they get a few more DNQs it will be "Hispania lose their sponsor!".

HRT for me do not have the charm of the 90s new teams like Pacific or Forti.

This could be a move for another Indian team

golic_2004 · Post by **golic_2004** » 02 May 2011, 11:09

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/91069

HRT aims to catch Virgin in Turkey