Grand Prix Rejects

Posted: **24 Apr 2024, 20:56**

dr-baker wrote: ↑24 Apr 2024, 19:22
dr-baker wrote: ↑24 Apr 2024, 05:48 If it were the start of the month, I would have taken this as an April Fool story. Bit it seems like Ferrari will not be racing in its iconic red livery in Miami, but rather in blue as a one-off to hark back to the blue and white livery of the North American Racing Team.
Seems like Ferrari have sold out to HP for at least this one race at Miami...

Hopefully they're getting their money's worth out of it. And I hope the car looks cool.

Posted: **25 Apr 2024, 15:33**

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/articles/cmm3v9ny78eo

If true, I did speculate a while back he could go Ferrari...

Posted: **25 Apr 2024, 16:19**

And Lawrence Stroll opens his cheque book (or Swiss bank account, crypto wallet, whatever they're all using these days), and...

...Adrian Newey decides to retire instead. Because he could, couldn't he? What more does he have to prove? The only reason he won't stop is because he can't stop.

Posted: **25 Apr 2024, 18:22**

Retirement would be good for him, I agree. Though, he's always liked bring champion. A run with Audi could also entice him when you think about it.

Posted: **25 Apr 2024, 18:28**

sswishbone wrote: ↑25 Apr 2024, 15:33 https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/articles/cmm3v9ny78eo

If true, I did speculate a while back he could go Ferrari...

Well, we will wait and see what happens, but I agree that Ferrari does seem plausible - it has the resources to support Newey's ambitions, some of Newey's close friends have moved to Ferrari and, if the rumours are true, they've been courting him for a while now.

Added to that, Newey did give an interview reasonably recently where he said that there were three things he still wanted to do - work for Ferrari, work with Hamilton and work with Alonso. With Hamilton moving to Ferrari, it would mean that Newey could achieve two of those ambitions in a single stroke.

dinizintheoven wrote: ↑25 Apr 2024, 16:19 And Lawrence Stroll opens his cheque book (or Swiss bank account, crypto wallet, whatever they're all using these days), and...

...Adrian Newey decides to retire instead. Because he could, couldn't he? What more does he have to prove? The only reason he won't stop is because he can't stop.

That is true, but at the same time, Newey doesn't seem to have shown any interest in stepping back just yet. It also has to be said that the same thing could be said of Rory Byrne, and yet, even though he turned 80 this year, he still works as a design consultant for Ferrari.

Posted: **25 Apr 2024, 18:33**

Newey's probably been rich enough to retire for at least 20 years. And maybe he views his last few championships as a peak that can't be bettered. But he does kind of seem like the kind of person who's going to work practically until he's dead. He can name his price and work as many days as he wants. I could totally see him going somewhere new (though maybe it won't be F1).

What I am now curious about is why there is the disconnect between what RB says Horner didn't do and Newey leaving over it. Unlike Marko and Horner, Newey doesn't seem overly interested in power politics...so maybe the process wasn't done properly (at least as far as Newey is concerned).

Posted: **25 Apr 2024, 20:52**

Row Man Gross-Gene wrote: ↑25 Apr 2024, 18:33 Newey's probably been rich enough to retire for at least 20 years. And maybe he views his last few championships as a peak that can't be bettered. But he does kind of seem like the kind of person who's going to work practically until he's dead. He can name his price and work as many days as he wants. I could totally see him going somewhere new (though maybe it won't be F1).

What I am now curious about is why there is the disconnect between what RB says Horner didn't do and Newey leaving over it. Unlike Marko and Horner, Newey doesn't seem overly interested in power politics...so maybe the process wasn't done properly (at least as far as Newey is concerned).

There is speculation that part of the reason why Newey may want to leave is because he wants to get away from that political infighting, and particularly the politics that surrounded the way that Red Bull dealt with the Horner case. There does seem to be some speculation that Newey may also have some deeper seated unease about the way the case was handled, although what exactly is causing that has been left unexplained.

The Race has also suggested that another possible reason, which is Horner's decision to promote Pierre Wache to Technical Director and push him into a more public facing role. That seems to have resulted in Newey being slightly sidelined and constrained in what he can do, somewhat to his frustration as a result.

Posted: **25 Apr 2024, 21:56**

mario wrote: ↑25 Apr 2024, 20:52
Row Man Gross-Gene wrote: ↑25 Apr 2024, 18:33 Newey's probably been rich enough to retire for at least 20 years. And maybe he views his last few championships as a peak that can't be bettered. But he does kind of seem like the kind of person who's going to work practically until he's dead. He can name his price and work as many days as he wants. I could totally see him going somewhere new (though maybe it won't be F1).

What I am now curious about is why there is the disconnect between what RB says Horner didn't do and Newey leaving over it. Unlike Marko and Horner, Newey doesn't seem overly interested in power politics...so maybe the process wasn't done properly (at least as far as Newey is concerned).
There is speculation that part of the reason why Newey may want to leave is because he wants to get away from that political infighting, and particularly the politics that surrounded the way that Red Bull dealt with the Horner case. There does seem to be some speculation that Newey may also have some deeper seated unease about the way the case was handled, although what exactly is causing that has been left unexplained.

The Race has also suggested that another possible reason, which is Horner's decision to promote Pierre Wache to Technical Director and push him into a more public facing role. That seems to have resulted in Newey being slightly sidelined and constrained in what he can do, somewhat to his frustration as a result.

Ok, so it may not be that he thinks Horner is guilty so much as he just doesn't like the level of politicking (which has gone up since Mateschitz passed away). Or even Red Bull needing a full-time person in his role, promoting Wache, and Newey feeling pushed out. Makes sense, I can totally see that.

Posted: **26 Apr 2024, 12:37**

Well, whilst we have Newey reportedly looking to move on, we have now had news of another figure definitely moving teams next year - Sauber have confirmed that Hulkenberg is moving to them for 2025. https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/articles/cjew54g41ego

Posted: **26 Apr 2024, 13:11**

I feel like that's a pretty plum drive for Nico. Maybe if they get the car right, he has a chance of getting that podium, probably around 2027. The article said they want Sainz, I wonder if they'll be on enough of an upward trajectory to lure him in?

Posted: **26 Apr 2024, 18:14**

Row Man Gross-Gene wrote: ↑26 Apr 2024, 13:11 I feel like that's a pretty plum drive for Nico. Maybe if they get the car right, he has a chance of getting that podium, probably around 2027. The article said they want Sainz, I wonder if they'll be on enough of an upward trajectory to lure him in?

I guess it depends quite how quickly the team manages to improve on their aerodynamic development once Audi completes their takeover, as it sounds like some investment is required in their facilities and their development team. Still, compared to Haas, you would expect them to show a distinctly upwards trajectory - but how quickly they can improve is yet to be seen.

In Sainz's case, I do wonder if he is perhaps in a position where he can afford to wait - his recent performances relative to Leclerc seem to be boosting his reputation, which means he might well be being courted by a few teams.

Posted: **27 Apr 2024, 19:33**

Good on The Hulk for that move. I do think he's a bit wasted in that Haas. Just shows you can still impress driving for a relatively poor team!

Posted: **28 Apr 2024, 15:16**

So Lando has been going a bit wild with his fellow orange people and whacking his nose about....

Posted: **28 Apr 2024, 20:37**

MyHamsterRacedAnOnyx wrote: ↑28 Apr 2024, 15:16 So Lando has been going a bit wild with his fellow orange people and whacking his nose about....

I wonder how hard he is going to celebrate once he wins his first-ever f1 race that doesn't look too far away.

Posted: **01 May 2024, 10:48**

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/articles/cv2rd53gnr6o

So my dumb theory may actually come to pass. I'm intrigued by what Eddie Jordan used to lever this deal through

Posted: **01 May 2024, 15:07**

Newey leaving Red Bull, ostensibly because of Horner's alleged shenanigans, is surely a significant issue for the team's owners?

Before Horner's blown diffuser (as it were) became a matter of public record, the team was unbeatable, was odds-on for the championship this year and next, a good head start in the new regs for 2026 led by the master of the rules' boundaries, had a great marketable asset in Verstappen, and had a stable management team.

Now Verstappen may be looking for a way out, probably taking Marko with him, the 2025 team will only have a cursory input from Newey and the 2026 car none, the asset that is Newey may be working for a rival, and the team is fractured. That all must undermine the team's market value and potential for future gowth and success. And it may polute the broader Red Bull brand values.

Perhaps the Thai owners should have fired Horner to obviate this?

Posted: **01 May 2024, 16:36**

Row Man Gross-Gene wrote: ↑24 Apr 2024, 20:56
dr-baker wrote: ↑24 Apr 2024, 19:22
dr-baker wrote: ↑24 Apr 2024, 05:48 If it were the start of the month, I would have taken this as an April Fool story. Bit it seems like Ferrari will not be racing in its iconic red livery in Miami, but rather in blue as a one-off to hark back to the blue and white livery of the North American Racing Team.
Seems like Ferrari have sold out to HP for at least this one race at Miami...
Hopefully they're getting their money's worth out of it. And I hope the car looks cool.

When Ferrari said that their cars were going to be blue for a race, I was disappointed because they have been predominantly red at every single race for over 40 years, possibly even over 50 years.

Then when they revealed their special livery, I was disappointed again, as the car was still predominantly red with just hints of blue.

Posted: **01 May 2024, 18:11**

IceG wrote: ↑01 May 2024, 15:07 Newey leaving Red Bull, ostensibly because of Horner's alleged shenanigans, is surely a significant issue for the team's owners?

Before Horner's blown diffuser (as it were) became a matter of public record, the team was unbeatable, was odds-on for the championship this year and next, a good head start in the new regs for 2026 led by the master of the rules' boundaries, had a great marketable asset in Verstappen, and had a stable management team.

Now Verstappen may be looking for a way out, probably taking Marko with him, the 2025 team will only have a cursory input from Newey and the 2026 car none, the asset that is Newey may be working for a rival, and the team is fractured. That all must undermine the team's market value and potential for future gowth and success. And it may polute the broader Red Bull brand values.

Perhaps the Thai owners should have fired Horner to obviate this?

I suspect that there might have been some problems with that approach as well though.

There has been talk that Horner was a popular figure within the team, and does still seem to have a level of popular support within the team, given the length of time he has worked for the team and the sense that he managed to turn a struggling outfit into a successful and influential team within the sport. If there was the impression that Horner was forced out without due process being carried out, I could see that also creating a backlash against the team and causing ructions within their management team - especially if some of those who have been closer to Horner started wondering if they would be targeted next.

Posted: **01 May 2024, 19:42**

dr-baker wrote: ↑01 May 2024, 16:36
Row Man Gross-Gene wrote: ↑24 Apr 2024, 20:56
dr-baker wrote: ↑24 Apr 2024, 19:22

Seems like Ferrari have sold out to HP for at least this one race at Miami...
Hopefully they're getting their money's worth out of it. And I hope the car looks cool.
When Ferrari said that their cars were going to be blue for a race, I was disappointed because they have been predominantly red at every single race for over 40 years, possibly even over 50 years.

Then when they revealed their special livery, I was disappointed again, as the car was still predominantly red with just hints of blue.

I just looked, (in case your work blocks twitter: https://www.ferrari.com/en-EN/formula1/ ... car-livery)

I'm disappointed too. No other word for it.

Posted: **02 May 2024, 00:44**

Meh. That's not a blue Ferrari. This is a blue Ferrari...

I'm much more taken by the RB Visa's livery for Miami which is... well...hologrammatic

And whilst we're at it, have a red Lotus 78...

Posted: **02 May 2024, 07:57**

Row Man Gross-Gene wrote: ↑01 May 2024, 19:42 I'm disappointed too. No other word for it.

Not enough blue or any blue is too much?

Personally I'd go with not enough blue on it as much as the Ferrari purists would disagree. If you're going to announce blue cars then I want to see blue cars.

Posted: **02 May 2024, 14:11**

CoopsII wrote: ↑02 May 2024, 07:57
Row Man Gross-Gene wrote: ↑01 May 2024, 19:42 I'm disappointed too. No other word for it.
Not enough blue or any blue is too much?

Personally I'd go with not enough blue on it as much as the Ferrari purists would disagree. If you're going to announce blue cars then I want to see blue cars.

Exactly, not enough blue. Full blue and white or maybe just red wings, I don't know. Just do something interesting. That said, it's Ferrari.

Posted: **05 May 2024, 05:13**

Can anyone who avoids the C4 coverage watch just 5 minutes of it to see how irritating Alex 'Stats' Jacques is.

Posted: **05 May 2024, 11:33**

How is David Croft with his obsession over race count since Alonso's last victory any better?

Posted: **05 May 2024, 12:22**

sswishbone wrote: ↑05 May 2024, 11:33 How is David Croft with his obsession over race count since Alonso's last victory any better?

Still better than Jonathan Legard...

Posted: **05 May 2024, 17:01**

dr-baker wrote: ↑05 May 2024, 12:22
sswishbone wrote: ↑05 May 2024, 11:33 How is David Croft with his obsession over race count since Alonso's last victory any better?
Still better than Jonathan Legard...

Even the train conductors of the UK are better than Legard...

Posted: **05 May 2024, 17:26**

sswishbone wrote: ↑05 May 2024, 17:01
dr-baker wrote: ↑05 May 2024, 12:22
sswishbone wrote: ↑05 May 2024, 11:33 How is David Croft with his obsession over race count since Alonso's last victory any better?
Still better than Jonathan Legard...
Even the train conductors of the UK are better than Legard...

To be fair, that wouldn't be hard.

Posted: **05 May 2024, 21:47**

I'm very pleased for Norris. Yes, he got a bit lucky with the timing of the safety car, but even so you'd usually have expected Verstappen to have just cruised up to and past him - even on an 'off' weekend. But hopefully it's a good sign for the rest of the season that this didn't happen, and not just a one-off at this track.

Posted: **16 May 2024, 16:27**

Albon, realizing he has no other real options, has signed a multi-year extension for Williams. With Alonso resigning, Hulk going to Audi, and the FIA receiving a waiver request to allow Kimi 2.0 in early, the silly season is wrapping up quickly.

One thing to keep your eyes on: over in NASCAR land, Gene Haas's team has been confirmed to be contracting from 4 cars to 2 for next year, and now the rumor is that is is for sale entirely........

Posted: **17 May 2024, 15:05**

Wallio wrote: ↑16 May 2024, 16:27 Albon, realizing he has no other real options, has signed a multi-year extension for Williams. With Alonso resigning, Hulk going to Audi, and the FIA receiving a waiver request to allow Kimi 2.0 in early, the silly season is wrapping up quickly.

One thing to keep your eyes on: over in NASCAR land, Gene Haas's team has been confirmed to be contracting from 4 cars to 2 for next year, and now the rumor is that is is for sale entirely........

Whilst Mercedes might be asking about a waiver, I suspect the FIA will be reluctant to grant an exemption to the rules to dissuade other teams from making similar requests.

As for Haas's NASCAR team, from what I can tell, the rumours seem to be that Haas might scale back from four to two cars and sell off the entry rights for the two slots they're not using to other teams, but selling the team entirely doesn't seem to be on the cards for now. Mind you, some have suggested that might be part of a wider dispute between teams and the France family over payments to the teams that have certain entry rights, so it's possibly tied in to wider politics in that series.

Posted: **17 May 2024, 16:14**

mario wrote: ↑17 May 2024, 15:05
Whilst Mercedes might be asking about a waiver, I suspect the FIA will be reluctant to grant an exemption to the rules to dissuade other teams from making similar requests.

Actually, since the FIA refuses to say who sent in the request, The-Race and a few other places seem to believe its Williams, trying to kick out Logan.

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