Ponderbox

Klon · Post by **Klon** » 16 Oct 2010, 19:52

Because this thread already has seen an expression of my raving insanity, I'll go ahead again - I currently am thinking that Panis, even after his broken leg(s?) could have been champion or at least a man with more than just one win if he had been more patient. Back in the day Häkkinen was quite angered with losing Olivier Panis as McLaren's test driver. Maybe if Panis would have stayed at McLaren, Mika would have proposed Panis as his successor and just maybe Ron would have listened to him. Assuming Panis' career would have gone as it did (i.e. until the end of 2004) Panis would have a race-winning car in 2002, a championship contending car in 2003 and ... a car in 2004, so that means even in his "weakend" state he could have won races. Well, I guess it's time to activate GPM2 and test it out.

WeirdKerr · Post by **WeirdKerr** » 16 Oct 2010, 20:41

Klon wrote:Because this thread already has seen an expression of my raving insanity, I'll go ahead again - I currently am thinking that Panis, even after his broken leg(s?) could have been champion or at least a man with more than just one win if he had been more patient. Back in the day Häkkinen was quite angered with losing Olivier Panis as McLaren's test driver. Maybe if Panis would have stayed at McLaren, Mika would have proposed Panis as his successor and just maybe Ron would have listened to him. Assuming Panis' career would have gone as it did (i.e. until the end of 2004) Panis would have a race-winning car in 2002, a championship contending car in 2003 and ... a car in 2004, so that means even in his "weakend" state he could have won races. Well, I guess it's time to activate GPM2 and test it out.

Panis would of been blown away by DC.......maybe, not that i am biased.....

Phoenix · Post by **Phoenix** » 17 Oct 2010, 09:44

Klon wrote:Because this thread already has seen an expression of my raving insanity, I'll go ahead again - I currently am thinking that Panis, even after his broken leg(s?) could have been champion or at least a man with more than just one win if he had been more patient. Back in the day Häkkinen was quite angered with losing Olivier Panis as McLaren's test driver. Maybe if Panis would have stayed at McLaren, Mika would have proposed Panis as his successor and just maybe Ron would have listened to him. Assuming Panis' career would have gone as it did (i.e. until the end of 2004) Panis would have a race-winning car in 2002, a championship contending car in 2003 and ... a car in 2004, so that means even in his "weakend" state he could have won races. Well, I guess it's time to activate GPM2 and test it out.

For starters, I pretty much doubt Panis would have been given a chance in McLaren. If that happened, I bet Coulthard would've had the best of him at least the first year.

ADx_Wales · Post by **ADx_Wales** » 18 Oct 2010, 23:26

The Jacerapegua layout.....clockwise....

fjackdaw · Post by **fjackdaw** » 18 Oct 2010, 23:33

I think the headline:

Green to replace Smith at Force India

should actually read:

Green to replace Orange at Force India

F1000X · Post by **F1000X** » 19 Oct 2010, 10:46

If Jean Alesi hadn't gone to Ferrari in 1991, would he have been a world champion? Certainly he might have won more races.

Jeroen Krautmeir · Post by **Jeroen Krautmeir** » 19 Oct 2010, 11:37

F1000X wrote:If Jean Alesi hadn't gone to Ferrari in 1991, would he have been a world champion? Certainly he might have won more races.

If he had accepted the Williams offer, he probably would have, considering he would have taken the seat that Nigel Mansell eventually got. Oh, what might have been...

CarlosFerreira · Post by **CarlosFerreira** » 19 Oct 2010, 13:48

fjackdaw wrote:I think the headline:

Green to replace Smith at Force India

should actually read:

Green to replace Orange at Force India

My hat, sir. I remove my hat and bow before you.

ADx_Wales · Post by **ADx_Wales** » 19 Oct 2010, 14:36

Jeroen Krautmeir wrote:
F1000X wrote:If Jean Alesi hadn't gone to Ferrari in 1991, would he have been a world champion? Certainly he might have won more races.

If he had accepted the Williams offer, he probably would have, considering he would have taken the seat that Nigel Mansell eventually got. Oh, what might have been...

If Modena managed second on the grid in 91, imagine what alesi would have achieved if he had one more year at tyrell with the best enigine of the era.

FullMetalJack · Post by **FullMetalJack** » 19 Oct 2010, 20:12

ADx_Wales wrote:
Jeroen Krautmeir wrote:
F1000X wrote:If Jean Alesi hadn't gone to Ferrari in 1991, would he have been a world champion? Certainly he might have won more races.

If he had accepted the Williams offer, he probably would have, considering he would have taken the seat that Nigel Mansell eventually got. Oh, what might have been...

If Modena managed second on the grid in 91, imagine what alesi would have achieved if he had one more year at tyrell with the best enigine of the era.

He wouldn't have been significantly better than Modena, to be fair to Stefano, he was the most underrated driver of that era.

Klon · Post by **Klon** » 19 Oct 2010, 20:33

Today, I saw an experiment on TV where they tried out if a person could control a real-life car while seeing it from a video game perspective (i.e. third person) and a gamer could pull it off quite well. I would love to see that experiment repeated with a real racing car.

Warren Hughes · Post by **Warren Hughes** » 19 Oct 2010, 20:41

One of the great things about this forum is that I can never remember which conversation is happening in which thread. The title of the thread being no help at all, of course.

Post by **Nuppiz** » 19 Oct 2010, 21:35

This year has been odd in that, for the first time in many years, us Finns can see our very own top drivers in advertisements that are shown only here in Finland. It isn't too often we have seen Kimi Räikkönen advertising cheap mobile phone and internet connections, or Heikki Kovalainen advertising a phone directory service.

Nessafox · Post by **Nessafox** » 19 Oct 2010, 23:09

Warren Hughes wrote:One of the great things about this forum is that I can never remember which conversation is happening in which thread. The title of the thread being no help at all, of course.

i'm doing my very best

Aerond · Post by **Aerond** » 19 Oct 2010, 23:58

ADx_Wales wrote:
Jeroen Krautmeir wrote:
F1000X wrote:If he had accepted the Williams offer, he probably would have, considering he would have taken the seat that Nigel Mansell eventually got. Oh, what might have been...

If Modena managed second on the grid in 91, imagine what alesi would have achieved if he had one more year at tyrell with the best enigine of the era.

He wouldn't have been significantly better than Modena, to be fair to Stefano, he was the most underrated driver of that era.

And that Honda engine was a stripped down version of the one McLaren had.

Jeroen Krautmeir · Post by **Jeroen Krautmeir** » 19 Oct 2010, 23:59

ADx_Wales wrote:
Jeroen Krautmeir wrote:
F1000X wrote:If Jean Alesi hadn't gone to Ferrari in 1991, would he have been a world champion? Certainly he might have won more races.

If he had accepted the Williams offer, he probably would have, considering he would have taken the seat that Nigel Mansell eventually got. Oh, what might have been...

If Modena managed second on the grid in 91, imagine what alesi would have achieved if he had one more year at tyrell with the best enigine of the era.

But despite having arguably one of the best chassis' of 1991, and one of the best engines of all time (the V10 of 1990), they only reach 6th in the standings, with a best of 2nd position. I agree though, if Alesi stayed on at Tyrrell, much more would have been achieved

Warren Hughes · Post by **Warren Hughes** » 20 Oct 2010, 22:43

On the BBC's Classic Grand Prix feature, there's footage of the 1985 Dutch GP, also featuring post-race interviews with the top two drivers, Niki Lauda and Alain Prost. During the interview, Prost uses the phrase 'for sure' in its standard F1 context (ie completely wrongly). Looks like it's not just a modern thing. Points to anyone who can find an earlier incidence of 'for sure'-ing from an F1 personality.

ADx_Wales · Post by **ADx_Wales** » 20 Oct 2010, 23:02

Warren Hughes wrote:On the BBC's Classic Grand Prix feature, there's footage of the 1985 Dutch GP, also featuring post-race interviews with the top two drivers, Niki Lauda and Alain Prost. During the interview, Prost uses the phrase 'for sure' in its standard F1 context (ie completely wrongly). Looks like it's not just a modern thing. Points to anyone who can find an earlier incidence of 'for sure'-ing from an F1 personality.

I know what your thinking, the 1982 San Marino Grand prix is the best of that group...

However:

Only 13 cars started the race due to political wrangling from one division of teams.
Its essentially a Ferrari demonstration run...
...at the nearest Circuit to the Ferrari Factory.

Had this race been anywhere else in the world this would have been an utter shambles, for instance if th 2005 San Marino GP only had the 6 Bridgestone runners who did Indy, none of the fans would have complained...

The outcome of the race lead to one of the greatest drivers of that generation having his morale instantly vanish as if some clever surgeon removed it, and then get killed in a crash not long later trying to prove a point.

HOW is this one of the great races?

coops · Post by **coops** » 21 Oct 2010, 08:18

ADx_Wales wrote:I know what your thinking, the 1982 San Marino Grand prix is the best of that group...
However:
Only 13 cars started the race due to political wrangling from one division of teams.
Its essentially a Ferrari demonstration run...
...at the nearest Circuit to the Ferrari Factory.
Had this race been anywhere else in the world this would have been an utter shambles, for instance if th 2005 San Marino GP only had the 6 Bridgestone runners who did Indy, none of the fans would have complained...
The outcome of the race lead to one of the greatest drivers of that generation having his morale instantly vanish as if some clever surgeon removed it, and then get killed in a crash not long later trying to prove a point.
HOW is this one of the great races?

Ummm. The reasons you just listed.

TomWazzleshaw · Post by **TomWazzleshaw** » 22 Oct 2010, 07:01

It may just be my driving style but a Formula 1 car sure does feel incredibly clumsy around the Hungaroring...

fjackdaw · Post by **fjackdaw** » 22 Oct 2010, 16:06

I just walked past David Coulthard at Milton Keynes train station. Shouldn't he be in Korea?

dr-baker · Post by **dr-baker** » 22 Oct 2010, 16:15

fjackdaw wrote:I just walked past David Coulthard at Milton Keynes train station. Shouldn't he be in Korea?

In this week's Autosport magazine:

David Coulthard wrote:...On the subject of McLaren, I'll be broadcasting from Woking this weekend as part of the BBC TV coverage. A lot of people don't realise how much is going on at the factory during a Grand Prix, and I'll be in the team's operation room, which should make for a good feature. I'l be getting up in the early hours like the rest of you!

Which doesn't explain why he's in MK, home of RBR, instead of Surrey, McLaren's home.

Post by **mario** » 22 Oct 2010, 17:01

ADx_Wales wrote:
Warren Hughes wrote:On the BBC's Classic Grand Prix feature, there's footage of the 1985 Dutch GP, also featuring post-race interviews with the top two drivers, Niki Lauda and Alain Prost. During the interview, Prost uses the phrase 'for sure' in its standard F1 context (ie completely wrongly). Looks like it's not just a modern thing. Points to anyone who can find an earlier incidence of 'for sure'-ing from an F1 personality.

I know what your thinking, the 1982 San Marino Grand prix is the best of that group...

However:

Only 13 cars started the race due to political wrangling from one division of teams.
Its essentially a Ferrari demonstration run...
...at the nearest Circuit to the Ferrari Factory.

Had this race been anywhere else in the world this would have been an utter shambles, for instance if th 2005 San Marino GP only had the 6 Bridgestone runners who did Indy, none of the fans would have complained...

The outcome of the race lead to one of the greatest drivers of that generation having his morale instantly vanish as if some clever surgeon removed it, and then get killed in a crash not long later trying to prove a point.

HOW is this one of the great races?

Because, up until Pironi's move on the last lap, and the implications that it held, the race had been thrilling to watch, despite the depleted field. Prost dropped out early on with a turbo failure, but until Lap 44, there was an almighty three way fight between Arnoux (his engine let go on lap 44), Villenuve and Pironi, since Arnoux was faster on the straights, but the Ferrari's were quicker in the corners. As such, for most of the race, the three drivers were swapping positions, only to overtake the other driver soon afterwards, and there were several quite brilliant moves done by all three drivers.

So, by no means was it a Ferrari demonstration run - in fact, it was because Renault were so strong that Ferrari hit problems, as the drivers were going so fast that they were using up fuel faster then anticipated, and Villeneuve was desperately trying to save fuel at the end so he would not run dry.

fjackdaw · Post by **fjackdaw** » 22 Oct 2010, 17:05

dr-baker wrote:
fjackdaw wrote:I just walked past David Coulthard at Milton Keynes train station. Shouldn't he be in Korea?

In this week's Autosport magazine:

David Coulthard wrote:...On the subject of McLaren, I'll be broadcasting from Woking this weekend as part of the BBC TV coverage. A lot of people don't realise how much is going on at the factory during a Grand Prix, and I'll be in the team's operation room, which should make for a good feature. I'l be getting up in the early hours like the rest of you!

Which doesn't explain why he's in MK, home of RBR, instead of Surrey, McLaren's home.

Ahh - thanks for that! I guess he just can't stay away from Red Bull...

ADx_Wales · Post by **ADx_Wales** » 22 Oct 2010, 17:46

DC is GMT-based because he will be at McLaren's "Mission Control" for the duration of the BBC Broadcast.

dr-baker · Post by **dr-baker** » 22 Oct 2010, 17:59

ADx_Wales wrote:DC is GMT-based because he will be at McLaren's "Mission Control" for the duration of the BBC Broadcast.

Sorry, but I have to say this: Duh! Context of that was clear in the original article, and the fact he was seen in MK!

Cynon · Post by **Cynon** » 22 Oct 2010, 18:51

Are we about to see Dallas GP part 3? Because I loved the Dallas GP, probably one of the best Formula 1 races ever, all due to the crap surface!

Warren Hughes · Post by **Warren Hughes** » 22 Oct 2010, 23:36

Cynon's new avatar freaks me out.

thehemogoblin · Post by **thehemogoblin** » 23 Oct 2010, 02:00

Warren Hughes wrote:Cynon's new avatar freaks me out.

Just watch as Kevin Conway Extenze his dominance throughout NASCAR...

ADx_Wales · Post by **ADx_Wales** » 23 Oct 2010, 08:57

dr-baker wrote:
ADx_Wales wrote:DC is GMT-based because he will be at McLaren's "Mission Control" for the duration of the BBC Broadcast.

Sorry, but I have to say this: Duh! Context of that was clear in the original article, and the fact he was seen in MK!

Well excuse me for not being able to read for a fraction of a second. :shock:

dr-baker · Post by **dr-baker** » 23 Oct 2010, 10:32

ADx_Wales wrote:
dr-baker wrote:
ADx_Wales wrote:DC is GMT-based because he will be at McLaren's "Mission Control" for the duration of the BBC Broadcast.

Sorry, but I have to say this: Duh! Context of that was clear in the original article, and the fact he was seen in MK!

Well excuse me for not being able to read for a fraction of a second.

Sorry!

ADx_Wales · Post by **ADx_Wales** » 23 Oct 2010, 11:54

If only Felipe had my skill of not paying attention...

midgrid · Post by **midgrid** » 23 Oct 2010, 21:04

The Korean circuit is the reincarnation of Aida. The track layout is similar (albeit about 50% longer): a couple of long straights, some fast esses and a some fiddly technical sessions, and the circuit itself seems very remote, isolated and lacking in infrastructure, and is also surrounded by hills.

dr-baker · Post by **dr-baker** » 23 Oct 2010, 21:11

ADx_Wales wrote:If only Felipe had my skill of not paying attention...

...Then the world could be a happier place. (Yes, I know the sentence didn't need finishing, but...).

Klon · Post by **Klon** » 23 Oct 2010, 23:48

midgrid wrote:The Korean circuit is the reincarnation of Aida. The track layout is similar (albeit about 50% longer): a couple of long straights, some fast esses and a some fiddly technical sessions, and the circuit itself seems very remote, isolated and lacking in infrastructure, and is also surrounded by hills.

I knew, I knew, that the whole scenery reminded me of something but I could not point out what is was. Thank you, midgrid, my brain can rest for now.

TomWazzleshaw · Post by **TomWazzleshaw** » 23 Oct 2010, 23:55

Klon wrote:
midgrid wrote:The Korean circuit is the reincarnation of Aida. The track layout is similar (albeit about 50% longer): a couple of long straights, some fast esses and a some fiddly technical sessions, and the circuit itself seems very remote, isolated and lacking in infrastructure, and is also surrounded by hills.

I knew, I knew, that the whole scenery reminded me of something but I could not point out what is was. Thank you, midgrid, my brain can rest for now.

Well according to Martin Brundle, Mark Webber said that the Korean circuit is a longer and faster version of the Hungaroring... and frankly I agree with Mark.

MinardiFan95 · Post by **MinardiFan95** » 24 Oct 2010, 09:21

Anyone who I pick to win in Predicamant Predictions usually retires from the race.

thehemogoblin · Post by **thehemogoblin** » 24 Oct 2010, 09:23

MinardiFan95 wrote:Anyone who I pick to win in Predicamant Predictions usually retires from the race.

Start picking Fernando Alonso and Sebastian Vettel, damn it.

Jordan192 · Post by **Jordan192** » 24 Oct 2010, 17:46

Ponderance 1:
His title bid may have taken a huge Wall-and-Rosberg shaped sing today, but damn is Mark Webber a classy guy
Not just immediately admitting to his mistake, but he didn't even try to suggest that they should have stayed being the safety car any longer. Not many drivers would have been so honest about it.

Ponderance 2:
Remember last year, when people were bleating about Button not deserving the title because he'd only been good in one half of the season? I wonder if those same people will cast the same aspersions at Alonso, who's basically (yeah, Bahrain, but go with it here) done exactly the same thing?

watka · Post by **watka** » 24 Oct 2010, 19:19

Wouldn't it be hilarious if HRT got 10th in the constructors' championship (with a 10th place for Yamamoto)...