Unusual F1 Stats

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girry
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Re: Unusual F1 Stats

Post by girry »

Simtek wrote:Kimi Raikkonen now has the longest gap between first and last F1 Grand Prix wins at 15 years and a certain amount of days, surpassing Michael Schumacher's previous record of 14 years and a certain amount of days.

In top-line Grand Prix racing as a whole, this even surpasses Felice Nazzaro's record of 15 years and a smaller number of days (Wikipedia says 2 weeks on the dot) between the 1907 and 1922 French Grands Prix, although that's just going off Grandes Épreuves... and my own memory.

EDIT: Just remembered Louis Chiron! 1928 Italian Grand Prix and 1949 French Grand Prix!


Yeah, it has to be Chiron when talking about Grands Prix proper.

Though I reckon the record-holder might still be someone else if we consider all races contested with top-line equipment. I know Christian Werner won 1924 Targa Florio in his old days, but am not sure how far early in the 1900's should we go for his first win? How about Louis Wagner or Trintignant?
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Re: Unusual F1 Stats

Post by Rob Dylan »

Though they were both fuel related, Ocon and Magnussen got disqualified for breaking different rules. I had a think about when this last was.

We've had many races with more than one DSQ. The more recent ones are:

- 2011 Australia: both Saubers Pérez and Kobayashi having dodgy rear wings.
- 2007 Canada: Massa and Fisichella leaving the pit lane while the red light was on.
- 2006 Germany: Albers and Monteiro, also for rear wings
- 2005 San Marino: Button and Sato for BAR. Some misdemeanour of no great consequence...
- 2004 Canada: Ralf Schumacher, da Matta, Panis and Montoya all for brake irregularities!

but you have to go all the way back to Australia 2002 to get the last race with multiple disqualifications for more than one reason. Both Arrows cars, Frentzen and Bernoldi, were disqualified for leaving the pit lane with the red light on, and changing to the spare car too late, respectively.

I just looked this up, so it might be wrong.

Citation needed
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Re: Unusual F1 Stats

Post by You-Gee-Eee-Day »

It just occured to me that, as far as I can tell, Williams will be the first team in F1 history to finish 11th in a championship of 10 teams.
:deletraz:

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"Ferrari is faster"
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Re: Unusual F1 Stats

Post by Nessafox »

You-Gee-Eee-Day wrote:It just occured to me that, as far as I can tell, Williams will be the first team in F1 history to finish 11th in a championship of 10 teams.

Ah no, Sahara Force India's points tally is officially reduced to 0. So that officially doesn't count.
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Re: Unusual F1 Stats

Post by You-Gee-Eee-Day »

This wrote:
You-Gee-Eee-Day wrote:It just occured to me that, as far as I can tell, Williams will be the first team in F1 history to finish 11th in a championship of 10 teams.

Ah no, Sahara Force India's points tally is officially reduced to 0. So that officially doesn't count.

Officially no, of course, but unofficially, I can't help but giggle when I read that line back to myself.
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Re: Unusual F1 Stats

Post by WeirdKerr »

will the age gap between Kimi and Max be the biggest age gap between consecutive winners?
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Re: Unusual F1 Stats

Post by Bobby Doorknobs »

WeirdKerr wrote:will the age gap between Kimi and Max be the biggest age gap between consecutive winners?

Peter Collins. Juan Manuel Fangio. 1956 French Grand Prix. 1956 British Grand Prix.

Don't know if that's the absolute record, but it immediately came to mind...
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Re: Unusual F1 Stats

Post by Aguvazk »

On these days it's coming the Brazil GP and i was thinking...Massa in 2008 could be WC in his home Gp. Was there another similar case? Maybe in the '50s...
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Re: Unusual F1 Stats

Post by Rob Dylan »

As far as I'm aware, the only time a driver won the F1 championship at their home race was in 1950, when Farina won it.

It's kind of a shame, because it would be amazing if that happened more often. Massa would have been the second.
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Re: Unusual F1 Stats

Post by tBone »

Rob Dylan wrote:As far as I'm aware, the only time a driver won the F1 championship at their home race was in 1950, when Farina won it.

It's kind of a shame, because it would be amazing if that happened more often. Massa would have been the second.

Michael Schumacher was very close in 2002. Raikkonen ran wide a couple of laps before the end of the French Grand Prix, handing Schumacher the win and the title. Would Kimi have kept the lead with Michael in second, he would probably have grabbed the title in the next race, which was the German Grand Prix.
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Re: Unusual F1 Stats

Post by Rob Dylan »

With Lance Stroll now reaching the wise old age of 20, I believe that this is the first F1 race without a teenager on the grid since Abu Dhabi 2014 (the infamous double points race).
Murray Walker at the 1997 Austrian Grand Prix wrote:The other [Stewart] driver, who nobody's been paying attention to, because he's disappointing, is Jan Magnussen.
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Re: Unusual F1 Stats

Post by UncreativeUsername37 »

This is the first time every driver has been in every race.
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Re: Unusual F1 Stats

Post by FortiWinks »

It will be 158 Grands Prix between Kubica’s last race in Abu Dhabi and Australia 2019 which will put him third on the list for the longest gap between two races.

The drivers who have longer gaps? Jan Lammers and Luca Badoer :badoer:

Not a great omen for him...
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Re: Unusual F1 Stats

Post by dr-baker »

UncreativeUsername37 wrote:This is the first time every driver has been in every race.

If it were not for Super Aguri withdrawing after 4 races, 2008 would share this record for no driver changes.
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Re: Unusual F1 Stats

Post by This Could Be You »

I know it's slightly old news now, but with Gasly off to Red Bull in place of Ricciardo, 2019 will be the first time since 2006 that Red Bull hasn't had an Australian in their driver lineup, and the first time in their history without having a English-speaking (well, as a first language, anyway) driver (unless you count Jaguar and Stewart as the same constructor, in which case the last time no native English speakers drove for them was 1998, one of only two seasons where this is the case, the other being their debut season)
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Re: Unusual F1 Stats

Post by UncreativeUsername37 »

2019 grid by first team they did at least 8 races for:
Mercedes: McLaren/Williams
Ferrari: Toro Rosso/Sauber
Red Bull: Toro Rosso/Toro Rosso
Renault: HRT/Williams
Haas: McLaren/Lotus
McLaren: Toro Rosso/McLaren*
Racing Point: Sauber/Williams
Sauber: Sauber/Sauber*
Toro Rosso: Toro Rosso/Toro Rosso*
Williams: Sauber/Williams*
*New driver I'm assuming will stay

Toro Rosso, Sauber, and Williams account for 75% of the grid, McLaren are responsible for most of the rest, and the other two teams are now bought out or fully don't exist. Ricciardo and Grosjean are admittedly slightly strange cases.
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Re: Unusual F1 Stats

Post by Faustus »

UncreativeUsername37 wrote:Ricciardo and Grosjean are admittedly slightly strange cases.


In so many ways...
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Re: Unusual F1 Stats

Post by Waris »

UncreativeUsername37 wrote:2019 grid by first team they did at least 8 races for:
[...]
Haas: McLaren/Lotus
[...]


I notice that often, as is the case here, Magnussen is listed as the first driver for Haas. How is that determined now that the car number doesn't tell you anything anymore? Is it the colour of the airbox cameras?
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Re: Unusual F1 Stats

Post by UncreativeUsername37 »

Waris wrote:I notice that often, as is the case here, Magnussen is listed as the first driver for Haas. How is that determined now that the car number doesn't tell you anything anymore? Is it the colour of the airbox cameras?

I tried to go by the entry list, but despite the number of times I looked at it, I still screwed up Haas because apparently Grosjean being put "ahead of" Magnussen was just too much to take.
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Re: Unusual F1 Stats

Post by Waris »

UncreativeUsername37 wrote:
Waris wrote:I notice that often, as is the case here, Magnussen is listed as the first driver for Haas. How is that determined now that the car number doesn't tell you anything anymore? Is it the colour of the airbox cameras?

I tried to go by the entry list, but despite the number of times I looked at it, I still screwed up Haas because apparently Grosjean being put "ahead of" Magnussen was just too much to take.


Ah, yeah.
I notice that on the entry list Russell is also listed as Williams' first driver and Kubica as the second. Maybe it's because Russell was confirmed first? I guess one shouldn't read too much into these things. It would be interesting to see if the order of the entry list actually matches the camera colours, though.
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Re: Unusual F1 Stats

Post by WeirdKerr »

I don't know what number Russell is using but Kubica will be 88....
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Re: Unusual F1 Stats

Post by AdrianBelmonte_ »

WeirdKerr wrote:I don't know what number Russell is using but Kubica will be 88....


Imagine if Fernando and him were teammates...
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Re: Unusual F1 Stats

Post by girry »

A total of WDC race distances led
Chris Amon: 248%
Jean-Pierre Jarier: 144%
Jean Behra: 115%
Romain Grosjean: 71%
Nico Hülkenberg: 64%
Ivan Capelli: 58%
Bruce McLaren: 54%

A total of WDC race victories
Chris Amon: 0
Jean-Pierre Jarier: 0
Jean Behra: 0
Romain Grosjean: 0
Nico Hülkenberg: 0
Ivan Capelli: 0
Bruce McLaren: 5
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Re: Unusual F1 Stats

Post by yannicksamlad »

Thanks giraurd - further evidence of the outrageous bad luck of Jumper Jarier . I was a big fan .....I still can't believe his final points tally in 1975
I started supporting Emmo in 1976 (3 points )....missed 75, 74, 73, 72...
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Re: Unusual F1 Stats

Post by Rob Dylan »

I'm pretty sure every race Will Smith has turned up to, Hamilton has won.
Murray Walker at the 1997 Austrian Grand Prix wrote:The other [Stewart] driver, who nobody's been paying attention to, because he's disappointing, is Jan Magnussen.
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Re: Unusual F1 Stats

Post by Bobby Doorknobs »

The 2019 Chinese Grand Prix will be:

  • The 1,040th race in the combined history of the AIACR World Manufacturers' Championship, AIACR European Drivers' Championship, CSI/FISA World Drivers' Championship, CSI/FISA International Cup for F1 Constructors, and FIA Formula One World Championship*
  • The 1,014th race in the combined history of the above minus the European Championship*
  • The 1,000th race in the combined history of the above minus the European Championship and the original World Championship
  • The 974th race counting towards any of the above championships run to the International Formula 1
  • The 658th race of the FIA Formula One World Championship

The number of F1 races run to date is unknown to me, but it's a heck of a lot more than 1,000.

*These counts exclude the 1928, 1929, 1930 and 1939 seasons. The former three seasons did not meet the minimum number of rounds for points to be awarded, while the latter season saw no championship awarded due to a dispute over the introduction of a new points system that went unresolved after the outbreak of the Second World War.
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Re: Unusual F1 Stats

Post by UncreativeUsername37 »

I'm going count every time I hear 1,000th F1 race versus 1,000th World Championship race in commentary during the weekend. Ideally such a decimal-centric milestone won't be made a big deal of, but I doubt that.
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Re: Unusual F1 Stats

Post by WeirdKerr »

It's crazy to think that I have actually watched over half of the F1 races :o :shock: having started watching F1 in 1986 (aussie gp And that's Collossal that is Manselllll....) though I didn't watch much of the 1987 season only from the Austrian GP onwards and I remember the 500th grand prix in Australia 1990.....
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Re: Unusual F1 Stats

Post by Rob Dylan »

So if we're just looking at numbers, Gasly has 13 points after four races; Kvyat had 21 points after the same number of races in 2016.
Murray Walker at the 1997 Austrian Grand Prix wrote:The other [Stewart] driver, who nobody's been paying attention to, because he's disappointing, is Jan Magnussen.
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Re: Unusual F1 Stats

Post by Bobby Doorknobs »

Rob Dylan wrote:So if we're just looking at numbers, Gasly has 13 points after four races; Kvyat had 21 points after the same number of races in 2016.

Verstappen to replace Gasly in Spain? :deletraz:
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Re: Unusual F1 Stats

Post by Rob Dylan »

Post of the year. :deletraz:
Murray Walker at the 1997 Austrian Grand Prix wrote:The other [Stewart] driver, who nobody's been paying attention to, because he's disappointing, is Jan Magnussen.
Felipe Nasr - the least forgettable F1 driver!
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Re: Unusual F1 Stats

Post by FortiWinks »

*Brain explodes*
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Re: Unusual F1 Stats

Post by Bobby Doorknobs »

And now, here's every race that coincided with a driver's birthday:

  • 1952 Swiss Grand Prix: Toulo de Graffenried (38). Finished 6th. Not bad.
  • 1959 Indianapolis 500: Chuck Arnold (33). Top-placed rookie in the field, but Rookie of the Year went to Bobby Grim.
  • 1962 German Grand Prix: Richie Ginther (32). An unremarkable 8th place.
  • 1963 British Grand Prix: Chris Amon (20). Ordinary 7th place drive.
  • 1967 Belgian Grand Prix: Denny Hulme (31). Was already having a bad day in the old BT19 before the engine couldn't take it anymore.
  • 1968 South African Grand Prix: Jacky Ickx (23). First race in the Ferrari, making good progress from a bad starting position before an oil pipe broke.
  • 1968 French Grand Prix: Jo Siffert (32). Race started while the Walker team was changing his battery, still managed to run as high as 8th.
  • 1968 British Grand Prix: Chris Amon (25). 2nd place, best Grande Épreuve result of the year and last finish. Only driver that looked like beating the Lotuses all day.
  • 1971 Italian Grand Prix: Clay Regazzoni (32). Went from 8th to 1st on the opening lap, and stayed in the leading pack until his engine died.
  • 1971 United States Grand Prix: Andrea de Adamich (30). Gave the Alfa Romeo T33 engine its second best result, which isn't saying a lot...
  • 1974 United States Grand Prix: Carlos Pace (30). Career best (thus far) 2nd place.
  • 1976 Dutch Grand Prix: James Hunt (29). Won and came within two points of the injured Lauda in the championship (pre-Brands Hatch exclusion)
  • 1978 Brazilian Grand Prix: Jody Scheckter (28). Started midfield and crashed.
  • 1978 Italian Grand Prix: Bruno Giacomelli (26). Managed to avoid the pile-up on the first start. Otherwise quite an unremarkable 14th place in the third McLaren.
  • 1978 United States Grand Prix: Jean-Pierre Jabouille (36). Scored Renault's first points and almost their first podium.
  • 1979 Canadian Grand Prix: Jochen Mass (33). Too slow in qualifying, but was first reserve in case someone couldn't take the start.
  • 1980 Belgian Grand Prix: John Watson (34). Last on the road, 11 laps down, but he did spend a while in the pits to get his brakes checked.
  • 1980 Austrian Grand Prix: Nelson Piquet (28). Only 5th and not doing his title bid any favours.
  • 1981 Argentine Grand Prix: Carlos Reutemann (39). Best man behind Piquet.
  • 1981 Monaco Grand Prix: Andrea de Cesaris (22). First race in the new McLaren MP4. Collided with Mario Andretti on the first lap (of course).
  • 1982 German Grand Prix: Nigel Mansell (29). 9th place from 18th on the grid.
  • 1983 French Grand Prix: Riccardo Patrese (29). Running in the top four before springing a water leak.
  • 1985 Italian Grand Prix: Stefan Johansson (29). Ran out of fuel at the end, but still classified where he would have finished anyway in 5th.
  • 1986 British Grand Prix: Thierry Boutsen (29). Spent much of the race at the back.
  • 1986 German Grand Prix: Philippe Alliot (32). Made his return to F1 replacing the injured Jacques Laffite at Ligier.
  • 1986 Austrian Grand Prix: Nelson Piquet (34). Again not doing his title bid any favours, but at least he could blame the engine this time.
  • 1987 Monaco Grand Prix: Andrea de Cesaris (28). The first of his record 12 consecutive retirements in one season.
  • 1988 Monaco Grand Prix: Luis Pérez-Sala (29). Dropped out just as he was looking at a top ten finish.
  • 1989 San Marino Grand Prix: Pierluigi Martini (28). Lasted only 6 laps because of a gearbox problem.
  • 1989 Belgian Grand Prix (FOR 2 DRIVERS!): Gerhard Berger (30) & Derek Warwick (35). Berger was best placed to challenge the McLarens only to spin on lap 10, whilst Warwick finished a very fine 6th.
  • 1991 Monaco Grand Prix: Stefano Modena (28). Was on for a repeat of Alesi's 1990 performance before the engine went.
  • 1991 Italian Grand Prix: Aguri Suzuki (31). Like Jochen Mass, DNQ.
  • 1992 Monaco Grand Prix: Andrea de Cesaris (33). Only lasted 9 laps. Gearbox acting up.
  • 1993 Monaco Grand Prix: Rubens Barrichello (21). 9th place, best result of his career thus far.
  • 1994 Spanish Grand Prix: Ukyo Katayama (31). Engine went after 16 laps.
  • 1995 Canadian Grand Prix: Jean Alesi (31). Won a race for the first and only time.
  • 1995 Belgian Grand Prix: Gerhard Berger (36). Started from pole for the only time that year, but made a poor start and eventually retired.
  • 1995 European Grand Prix: Jean-Denis Délétraz (32). Prompted Murray Walker to say the famous quote.
  • 1997 British Grand Prix: Jarno Trulli (23). Second race in the Prost. He was slowly getting there...
  • 1997 Luxembourg Grand Prix: Mika Häkkinen (29). Started from pole for the first time. Looked good for his first win as well but the engine didn't agree with him.
  • 2000 San Marino Grand Prix: Jacques Villeneuve (29). Finished a hard-fought 5th.
  • 2001 Australian Grand Prix: Jos Verstappen (29). Overtook under yellows the mad bastard.
  • 2001 German Grand Prix: Fernando Alonso (20). Spun in the warm-up session, started from the pitlane, had a refuelling scare, finished last (driving for Minardi ain't easy).
  • 2001 Belgian Grand Prix: Olivier Panis (35). Finished 11th after a stop-go penalty for crossing the white line at the pit exit.
  • 2003 Austrian Grand Prix: Heinz-Harald Frentzen (36). One of the launch control victims, and the only one not to make the final start.
  • 2004 San Marino Grand Prix: Felipe Massa (23). Average 10th place.
  • 2004 Monaco Grand Prix: Rubens Barrichello (32). Average 3rd place.
  • 2004 European Grand Prix: Gianmaria Bruni (23). Beat his teammate, best finish of his season (and career).
  • 2005 German Grand Prix: Tiago Monteiro (29). Started behind the Minardis, beaten by Karthikeyan in the race.
  • 2005 Belgian Grand Prix: Antônio Pizzonia (25). Hit Montoya while trying to unlap himself.
  • 2006 Hungarian Grand Prix: Vitantonio Liuzzi (26). Got rear-ended by Kimi Räikkönen.
  • 2006 Turkish Grand Prix: Mark Webber (30). First finish since Canada, not that that's saying a lot.
  • 2008 Chinese Grand Prix: Heikki Kovalainen (27). Tyre problems upon tyre problems.
  • 2009 Spanish Grand Prix: Nick Heidfeld (32). Slightly boring 7th place, but took the most consecutive race finishes record in the process.
  • 2010 European Grand Prix: Nico Rosberg (25). Bad race all around for Mercedes, finished only 10th.
  • 2012 Australian Grand Prix: Timo Glock (30). Last on the road, and equal best result of the season.
  • 2012 Hungarian Grand Prix: Fernando Alonso (31). Standard 5th place drive, but extended his lead over 2nd-placed Webber in the championship.
  • 2013 Bahrain Grand Prix: Max Chilton (22). An inspired 20th place drive from all the way back in 22nd on the grid.
  • 2014 Japanese Grand Prix: Kevin Magnussen (22). Couldn't find any grip in those conditions.
  • 2016 Chinese Grand Prix: Romain Grosjean (30). Hit some debris on the first lap, finished 19th after the forced early pit stop.
  • 2016 Austrian Grand Prix: Sebastian Vettel (29). Had a big ol' tyre failure.
  • 2016 Belgian Grand Prix: Valtteri Bottas (27). Ordinary 8th place drive.
  • 2017 Australian Grand Prix: Stoffel Vandoorne (25). His first race back in F1... not much happened.
  • 2017 Singapore Grand Prix: Esteban Ocon (21). Only finished 10th despite all the madness.
  • 2017 Mexican Grand Prix: Lance Stroll (19). A genuinely impressive 6th place.
  • 2018 Austrian Grand Prix: Daniel Ricciardo (29). One of many retirements for him that year.
  • 2018 Hungarian Grand Prix: Fernando Alonso (37). Standard (for his side of the garage) 8th place.
  • 2018 Italian Grand Prix: Marcus Ericsson (28). Only 15th.
  • 2018 Russian Grand Prix: Max Verstappen (21). Came from the back of the grid to lead during a pit window, finished 5th in the end.
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Re: Unusual F1 Stats

Post by Bleu »

If there are no driver changes during the season, the only addition this year will be Carlos Sainz at the Belgian Grand Prix.
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Re: Unusual F1 Stats

Post by Rob Dylan »

It's race five, with points down to tenth place, and Mercedes have more points than Ferrari and Red Bull combined.
Murray Walker at the 1997 Austrian Grand Prix wrote:The other [Stewart] driver, who nobody's been paying attention to, because he's disappointing, is Jan Magnussen.
Felipe Nasr - the least forgettable F1 driver!
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Re: Unusual F1 Stats

Post by Rob Dylan »

Was chatting with You-Gee-Eee-Day and started doing some podium research statistics.

So:
- 110 races since 2014
- 330 podiums
- 23 podiums outside Mercedes, Ferrari, and Red Bull.
- 7% of podiums not in the top teams.

7% isn't that bad, surely. Ok, well let's take off 2014, as Williams had 12 of those podiums.

- 91 races since 2015
- 273 podiums
- 11 podiums outside Mercedes, Ferrari, and Red Bull.
- 4% of podiums not in the top teams.


- 72 races since 2016
- 216 podiums
- 5 podiums outside Mercedes, Ferrari, and Red Bull.
- 2% of podiums not in the top teams.


- 51 races since 2017
- 153 podiums
- 2 podiums outside Mercedes, Ferrari, and Red Bull.
- 1% of podiums not in the top teams.

Gulp. It seems to get worse the closer you get to the present.
Murray Walker at the 1997 Austrian Grand Prix wrote:The other [Stewart] driver, who nobody's been paying attention to, because he's disappointing, is Jan Magnussen.
Felipe Nasr - the least forgettable F1 driver!
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Re: Unusual F1 Stats

Post by yannicksamlad »

Wow .
I'm so old that as a kid looking at F1 stats I thought 1973 was a bit odd having only 3 teams winning races . But Surtees, Shadow and Brabham got onto the podium.

I really think this lack of variation in results underlies a lot of the dissatisfaction with F1.
I started supporting Emmo in 1976 (3 points )....missed 75, 74, 73, 72...
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FullMetalJack
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Re: Unusual F1 Stats

Post by FullMetalJack »

yannicksamlad wrote:Wow .
I'm so old that as a kid looking at F1 stats I thought 1973 was a bit odd having only 3 teams winning races . But Surtees, Shadow and Brabham got onto the podium.

I really think this lack of variation in results underlies a lot of the dissatisfaction with F1.


A big part of why ultra reliability is the main problem with F1. Halfway through the season and we've had five drivers on the podium all season. We may get a sixth driver by the end of the season, but I highly doubt it.
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Re: Unusual F1 Stats

Post by Marco »

I recently did a similar statistic, back to 1987

Code: Select all

Year / Different Teams on the Podium / Total Podiums for Teams P4 or worse in constructors standings
2019  3                     0
2018  4                     1
2017  4                     1
2016  5                     3
2015  6                     5
2014  6                     5
2013  4                     14
2012  7                     18
2011  4                     2
2010  7                     6
2009  8                     15
2008  9                     11
2007  6                     3   (I count McLaren as Top3)
2006  7                     7
2005  7                     12
2004  5                     8
2003  6                     7
2002  4                     1
2001  6                     5
2000  5                     5
1999  7                     9
1998  6                     6
1997  9                     15
1996  6                     8
1995  8                     8
1994  7                     12
1993  5                     6
1992  4                     2
1991  6                     5
1990  7                     8
1989  10                    10
1988  7                     8
1987  6                     10


While we did have a few single years that were similar to today (1992,2002,2011) we now have a very long streak where the top 3 teams totally dominate the podium positions, and in the last years it was also always the same 3 teams. I mean, this year, after 10 races, the best position of a driver from another team was P6 - or in different terms: only 7 drivers would not be 2019-rejects. Even 1988, which is always seen as prime example for one team dominating, had 7 different teams on the podium.

Sure, one reason is the almost perfect reliability today. But even wet races don't bring unexpected results anymore (because there are almost no gravel traps and the walls are far away, so almost nobody DNFs?)

We don't get things like Kobayashi on P3 in Suzuka, Button winning on a wet Hungaroring, Fisico winning by staying on the track in Interlagos or Herbert giving Stewart a victory anymore...
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