Grand Prix Rejects

Posted: **19 Dec 2015, 16:13**

With the rumours swirling around Mercedes at the moment, I thought It'd be a good time to start a new silly season thread. And what's sillier than starting it in 2015?.

2017 Line ups:

Mercedes - Lewis & ?

Ferrari - Vettel & ?

Williams - Bottas & ?

Red Bull - Ricciardo & Kvyat?

Force India/Diago/Aston Martin - Perez & Hulkenberg?

Toro Rosso - Verstappen & Sainz?

Sauber -???

Mclaren ??

Haas - Grosjean & ?

Renault - Maldonado & ?

Manor - Probably won't be around ;(

Stefan F1 - Villeneuve & Barrichello

Possible retirees - Kimi, Jenson, Alonso, Massa

I can foresee Grosjean either moving to Ferrari or back to Renault. Stoffel will hopefully be joining Mclaren. Max will only move up to the senior Red Bull seat if Kvyat under performs. I reckon Pastor will have a good season and keep his Renault seat. Nasr might move up to replace Massa at Williams. But where will Rosberg end up? Will he stay or go? If this Aston Martin deal gets confirmed I can see him being sent there as a punishment.

Posted: **19 Dec 2015, 19:52**

Why is Massa maybe going to retire? He hasn't left before like Räikkönen or seriously thought about it like Button and maybe Alonso.

Posted: **19 Dec 2015, 20:04**

As I've said previously, the only really logical choices for Ferrari at this stage are either keeping Raikkonen, or grabbing Ricciardo. They had the option to grab the likes of Hulkenberg and Grosjean, Bottas isn't putting Massa away to the extent that you'd hope for given how soundly Massa was beaten by Alonso... Perez might be an option if he continues his 2015 form, but Verstappen is in the middle of a 3 year contract and Red Bull aren't just gonna let Ferrari have him.

Posted: **20 Dec 2015, 00:00**

Izzyeviel wrote:Stefan F1 - Villeneuve & Barrichello

Posted: **20 Dec 2015, 05:22**

So this thread so far is just posting the 2016 line-up with a few question marks. Next!

Posted: **20 Dec 2015, 06:57**

AustralianStig wrote:So this thread so far is just posting the 2016 line-up with a few question marks. Next!

Will Nurburgring host F1 again?
Will F1 return to the Nordachleife layout?
Will Baku survives after 1 year?
Will LeMans clashed again?
Will finally Monaco won't clash with Indy 500?
Will Port Imperial *finally* made it to the calendar?

Posted: **20 Dec 2015, 11:24**

AxelP800 wrote:
AustralianStig wrote:So this thread so far is just posting the 2016 line-up with a few question marks. Next!

Will Nurburgring host F1 again?
Will F1 return to the Nordachleife layout?
Will Baku survives after 1 year?
Will LeMans clashed again?
Will finally Monaco won't clash with Indy 500?
Will Port Imperial *finally* made it to the calendar?

Will AxelP800's grammar improve?

Posted: **20 Dec 2015, 12:06**

Merc - Lewis / Ricciardo
Ferrari - Vettel / Bottas
Williams - Rosberg / Nasr
Renault - Perez / Palmer
Mclaren - Alonso / Vandoorne
AM - Hulk / Wehrlein
Sauber - Sirotkin / Sainz
RB - Kvyat / Max
TR - Gasly / Leclerc
Manor - Haryanto / King
Haas - RoGro / Rossi

Posted: **20 Dec 2015, 14:29**

This wrote:
AxelP800 wrote:
AustralianStig wrote:So this thread so far is just posting the 2016 line-up with a few question marks. Next!

Will Nurburgring host F1 again?
Will F1 return to the Nordachleife layout?
Will Baku survives after 1 year?
Will LeMans clashed again?
Will finally Monaco won't clash with Indy 500?
Will Port Imperial *finally* made it to the calendar?

Will AxelP800's grammar improve?

*Nordschleife

I can only perfect with Indonesian

Posted: **20 Dec 2015, 15:33**

Ericsson to Mercedes and Maldonado to Ferrari pls.

Posted: **21 Dec 2015, 02:38**

AxelP800 wrote:
This wrote:
AxelP800 wrote:Will Nurburgring host F1 again?
Will F1 return to the Nordachleife layout?
Will Baku survives after 1 year?
Will LeMans clashed again?
Will finally Monaco won't clash with Indy 500?
Will Port Imperial *finally* made it to the calendar?

Will AxelP800's grammar improve?

*Nordschleife

I can only perfect with Indonesian

I was actually referring to the unusual way you use verbs. Then again, i'm also guilty of speaking Flemglish.

Posted: **21 Dec 2015, 12:23**

giraurd wrote:Merc - Lewis / Ricciardo
Ferrari - Vettel / Bottas
Williams - Rosberg / Nasr
Renault - Perez / Palmer
Mclaren - Alonso / Vandoorne
AM - Hulk / Wehrlein
Sauber - Sirotkin / Sainz
RB - Kvyat / Max
TR - Gasly / Leclerc
Manor - Haryanto / King
Haas - RoGro / Rossi

Hasn't Sirotkin cut ties with Sauber? Nonetheless I can't see RB letting Ricciardo go.
I Believe Mercedes will keep Rosberg and buy the Manor seats for Esteban Ocon and Wehrlien

Mercedes: Hamilton, Rosberg
Ferrari: Vettel, Grosjean (Bottas)
Williams: (Bottas), Lynn, Massa
RB: Riccardo, Kvyat (Verstappen)
McLaren: Alonso, Vandoorne
Torro rosso: Sainz, Verstappen (Gasly)
Sauber; Nasr, Marceillo (Ghitto)
The rest don't have a clue

Posted: **21 Dec 2015, 14:16**

andrew wrote:
giraurd wrote:Merc - Lewis / Ricciardo
Ferrari - Vettel / Bottas
Williams - Rosberg / Nasr
Renault - Perez / Palmer
Mclaren - Alonso / Vandoorne
AM - Hulk / Wehrlein
Sauber - Sirotkin / Sainz
RB - Kvyat / Max
TR - Gasly / Leclerc
Manor - Haryanto / King
Haas - RoGro / Rossi

Hasn't Sirotkin cut ties with Sauber? Nonetheless I can't see RB letting Ricciardo go.
I Believe Mercedes will keep Rosberg and buy the Manor seats for Esteban Ocon and Wehrlien

Mercedes: Hamilton, Rosberg
Ferrari: Vettel, Grosjean (Bottas)
Williams: (Bottas), Lynn, Massa
RB: Riccardo, Kvyat (Verstappen)
McLaren: Alonso, Vandoorne
Torro rosso: Sainz, Verstappen (Gasly)
Sauber; Nasr, Marceillo (Ghitto)
The rest don't have a clue

Yes, it seems that Sirotkin's links with Sauber were severed some time ago, reportedly on the grounds that the restrictions imposed on specific Russian corporations as a result of the conflict in eastern Ukraine meant that Sirotkin was unable to pay up as planned.

Posted: **21 Dec 2015, 16:38**

andrew wrote:Nonetheless I can't see RB letting Ricciardo go.

His contract ends at the end of 2016 - if he wants to go, he can go.

Posted: **21 Dec 2015, 17:25**

Salamander wrote:
andrew wrote:Nonetheless I can't see RB letting Ricciardo go.

His contract ends at the end of 2016 - if he wants to go, he can go.

Ah ok did not know that, thanks.

Posted: **21 Dec 2015, 20:51**

Salamander wrote:
andrew wrote:Nonetheless I can't see RB letting Ricciardo go.

His contract ends at the end of 2016 - if he wants to go, he can go.

There are some indications that, although his contract runs out at the end of 2016, Red Bull appear to have the option of potentially extending his contract up to 2018.

Posted: **24 Dec 2015, 13:34**

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/122334

The Indonesian is rumoured to have £10million worth of backing from his national government, a figure that left Wolff concerned.

"With the amount that was in the media to buy a ride like this you destroy F1," he said.

So, now they're concerned about the financial problems the small teams got. Such big team logic 8-)

Posted: **24 Dec 2015, 13:52**

giraurd wrote:http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/122334

The Indonesian is rumoured to have £10million worth of backing from his national government, a figure that left Wolff concerned.

"With the amount that was in the media to buy a ride like this you destroy F1," he said.

So, now they're concerned about the financial problems the small teams got. Such big team logic

And yet didn't feel any need to mention the fact Pastor Maldonado effectively bankrolls his entire team, with a sponsor packet close to £30 million...

Posted: **24 Dec 2015, 16:26**

Biscione wrote:
giraurd wrote:http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/122334

The Indonesian is rumoured to have £10million worth of backing from his national government, a figure that left Wolff concerned.

"With the amount that was in the media to buy a ride like this you destroy F1," he said.

So, now they're concerned about the financial problems the small teams got. Such big team logic

And yet didn't feel any need to mention the fact Pastor Maldonado effectively bankrolls his entire team, with a sponsor packet close to £30 million...

And even then, they needed to sell out to a manufacturer to survive...

Posted: **24 Dec 2015, 16:55**

The Indonesian is rumoured to have £10million worth of backing from his national government, a figure that left Wolff concerned.

"With the amount that was in the media to buy a ride like this you destroy F1," he said.

Why are so many journalists simply happy to get a juicy quote like that and not ask the man a simple question such as "What are you talking about you stupid man?"

Posted: **25 Dec 2015, 10:50**

andrew wrote:Mercedes: Hamilton, Rosberg
Ferrari: Vettel, Grosjean (Bottas)
Williams: (Bottas), Lynn, Massa
RB: Riccardo, Kvyat (Verstappen)
McLaren: Alonso, Vandoorne
Torro rosso: Sainz, Verstappen (Gasly)
Sauber; Nasr, Marceillo (Ghitto)
The rest don't have a clue

I can't see Marciello making it to Formula One anymore. He should have showed during his second season he could be a serious championship contender in GP2, yet he astonishingly underperformed (especially if compared to what Vandoorne, a driver Lello was often compared with, delivered). He'll most probably find a seat in DTM.

Posted: **25 Dec 2015, 15:29**

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/122336

Ferrari to evaluate Gutierrez for future F1 drive in 2016, Haas says

I feel tempted to revert back to my GutiGuti avatar.

Posted: **29 Dec 2015, 05:51**

To predict the 2017 silly season, we first need to predict how well every driver does in 2016.
Beats their teammate comprehensively: Vettel>Räikkönen, Alonso>Button, Maldonado>Palmer, Verstappen>Sainz (the big change), Nasr>Ericsson, Grosjean>Gutiérrez, Rossi>Stevens
Beats their teammate but not by a lot: Hamilton>Rosberg, Pérez>Hülkenberg
About level: Bottas/Massa, Ricciardo/Kvyat

Mercedes are sick of Rosberg, as are Ferrari of Räikkönen. Everything else silly season grinds to a halt until they make up their minds. Grosjean's Haas scheme works and Ferrari take him. Although something about it feels weird and unlikely to me, Mercedes taking Verstappen is the obvious next thing, assuming Ferrari trouble them for more than a few scattered races. If Mercedes were dominant, they would rather not risk changing their lineup, but with Vettel frequently among them, Rosberg isn't good enough and something has to be done.

Williams and Red Bull have no reason to change anything. This is fine for Williams; even if Lynn stomps GP2, being team #3 is enough excuse to not take in a rookie. It's also fine for Red Bull, since Verstappen was a counterproductive waste of resources. Next likely point of failure for me: Force India throw Hülkenberg out because Mercedes pay for di Resta try #2, i.e., Wehrlein. McLaren keep Alonso and bring in Vandoorne.

Renault will probably go for talent instead of money. They take in Rosberg and... I dunno... promote Buemi from their FE team. I have no idea. Haas pick up Rossi and keep Gutiérrez, as Ferrari's bemusing faith in him continues. Also there are no other North Americans. Finally, Nasr is still stick at Sauber, and now has Maldonado for company.

Mercedes: Hamilton/Verstappen
Ferrari: Vettel/Grosjean
Williams: Bottas/Massa
Red Bull: Ricciardo/Kvyat
Force India: Pérez/Wehrlein
McLaren: Alonso/Vandoorne
Renault: Rosberg / Hülkenberg/Rowland/Buemi/Wickens/Mansell
Toro Rosso: Whatever academy guys do well
Haas: Rossi/Gutiérrez
Sauber: Nasr/Maldonado
Manor: Money

Posted: **30 Dec 2015, 09:37**

With Ferrari and Red Bull having their lineup pretty much locked for the coming years, Rosberg going to Renault is an interesting suggestion. I think the guy's possibly pushing to get a seat at Williams for a year or two as he waits for another chance at a team with a title shot. But yeah, if Renault have a successful comeback in 2016, Nico could theoretically jump there for a year or two with the same stopgap method.

Posted: **30 Dec 2015, 11:05**

Rob Dylan wrote:With Ferrari and Red Bull having their lineup pretty much locked for the coming years, Rosberg going to Renault is an interesting suggestion. I think the guy's possibly pushing to get a seat at Williams for a year or two as he waits for another chance at a team with a title shot. But yeah, if Renault have a successful comeback in 2016, Nico could theoretically jump there for a year or two with the same stopgap method.

The thing is, I would suspect that 2016 is going to be a fairly tough year for Renault and they are unlikely to make much progress towards the front of the field.

Lotus had to shed quite a few people over 2015 in order to stay afloat (93 people were made redundant), so the first stage is simply going to be to make up for the loss of experienced personnel over the course of the year. Asides from that, the protracted talks over the takeover meant that Lotus had severe cashflow issues which, combined with uncertainty over whether they would be using a Renault or Mercedes powerplant, means that development of their 2016 car was severely disrupted (and you suspect that the design will now have to be revised slightly to account for the differences in packaging between the Mercedes and Renault power units).

On top of that, is there really that much of an incentive for Renault to spend heavily on a 2016 campaign either? With major regulation changes due in 2017, you would imagine that most teams will be throwing more effort at their 2017 cars in an effort to try and secure an advantage at the start of the new regulations era. It would make far more sense for Renault to run a fairly low key campaign in 2016 and to take some pain for their first year back in order to rebuild the team and concentrate their resources on 2017, when they might have a better chance of moving back towards the front.

Posted: **23 Jan 2016, 12:41**

Common sense is prevailing, I think. Seriously, who thought the return of refuelling would be worth the extra expense and risk?

Posted: **23 Jan 2016, 21:52**

dr-baker wrote:Common sense is prevailing, I think. Seriously, who thought the return of refuelling would be worth the extra expense and risk?

Given that the suggestion seems to have had fairly limited popular support, not to mention how quickly the idea was dropped, it feels more like the topic was raised solely to distract attention from something else.

One possibility could be the fact that Symonds had been publicly pushing for the 2017 regulation package to be postponed to 2018 at around the same time, over concerns that everybody is rushing into making changes without fully thinking through the implications. Given that there are probably a lot of teams who might benefit from that new package, I suspect that some do not want the current regulation package to be maintained for 2017 and are therefore keen to sink any proposal to postpone implementation of the new aero rules.

Posted: **26 Jan 2016, 11:28**

All these possible 2017 line-ups are flawed and unrealistic. Logic dictates this will be the 2017 line-up:

Mercedes: Nigel Mansell / Sebastian Vettel
Ferrari: Jenson Button / Max Verstappen
Williams: Fernando Alonso / Keke Rosberg
Red Bull: Lewis Hamilton / Stoffel Vandoorne
Force India: Pastor Maldonado / Carlos Sainz Jr.
McLaren: Romain Grosjean / Daniil Kvyat
Renault: Sergio Perez / Daniel Ricciardo
Toro Rosso: Pierre Gasly / Nyck de Vries
Haas: Nico Hulkenberg / Kevin Magnussen
Sauber: Alex Lynn / Nobuharu Matsushita
Manor: Pascal Wehrlein / Felipe Nasr

There. No need to thank.

Posted: **26 Jan 2016, 11:33**

DanielPT wrote:All these possible 2017 line-ups are flawed and unrealistic. Logic dictates this will be the 2017 line-up:

Mercedes: Nigel Mansell / Sebastian Vettel
Ferrari: Jenson Button / Max Verstappen
Williams: Fernando Alonso / Keke Rosberg
Red Bull: Lewis Hamilton / Stoffel Vandoorne
Force India: Pastor Maldonado / Carlos Sainz Jr.
McLaren: Romain Grosjean / Daniil Kvyat
Renault: Sergio Perez / Daniel Ricciardo
Toro Rosso: Pierre Gasly / Nyck de Vries
Haas: Nico Hulkenberg / Kevin Magnussen
Sauber: Alex Lynn / Nobuharu Matsushita
Manor: Pascal Wehrlein / Felipe Nasr
Stefan: Rubens Barrichello / Jacques Villeneuve

There. No need to thank.

Fixed.

Posted: **26 Jan 2016, 16:37**

My predictions for 2017

Ferrari
Sebastian Vettel
Valtteri Bottas

Ferrari need a low maintenance team mate for Seb to replace the retiring Raikkonen, and although he isn't that much faster than Massa, Vettel likes Finnish blokes so Valtteri could well become Stefan Johansson mark 2.

Force India - Mercedes
Nico Hulkenberg
Sergio Perez

Still no sign of Aston Martin, but why fix what isn't broken on the drivers front. Hulkenberg wants to do Le Mans again.

Haas - Ferrari
Romain Grosjean
Esteban Guttierez

Stability is the key word for Haas after a so-so debut year, so no changes here.

MRT - Mercedes
Alex Rossi
Sergey Sirotkin

Alex Rossi becomes something of a fixture at MRT after a decent 2016, and Sirotkin brings sponsorship money after and excellent GP2 campaign. Things aren't amazing but they are a world away from 2014/15.

McLaren - Honda
Fernando Alonso
Stoffel Vandoorne

2016 goes much better than 2015, and Alonso expects to challenge for the title in 2017. Vandoorne replaces a retiring Jenson Button.

Mercedes
Lewis Hamilton
Nico Rosberg

A strong Ferrari in 2016 means Mercedes rally together and infighting lessens, so there is no need to swap drivers. Rosberg seems more resigned to his fate than previously although still matches Hamilton often, kinda like a 2012-spec Mark Webber.

Red Bull - Mercedes
Daniel Ricciardo
Daniil Kvyat

Red Bull finally get the Mercedes engine they so crave, and Ricciardo expects to challenge for the title. Kvyat is also capable of winning races on his day, but Verstappen wants his seat and he knows it.

Renault
Kevin Magnussen
Jean-Eric Vergne

Venezuela could well be on the brink of civil war by then, so no Maldonado to be seen. Kevin Magnussen proves capable (think 2010 Robert Kubica) but the board want a Frenchman on board so Palmer is replaced by JEV.

Sauber - Ferrari
Felipe Nasr
Rio Haryanto

Sauber are struggling to stay afloat, and are reduced to fighting with MRT for an occasional 10th place at best. Haryanto and his tasty sponsorship replace a disappointing Ericsson, and Nasr is held in very high regard by the team, as is his Banco de Brazil money.

Toro Rosso - Ferrari
Max Verstappen
Carlos Sainz, Jr.

Max is getting frustrated after not being promoted to Red Bull, and may leave at the end of the year if this does not happen. Carlos Sainz is still there but beginning to look very Buemi-ish. Pierre Gasly waits in the wings hungrily, as it is expected there will be a driver shake-up for 2018. Toro Rosso remain Ferrari-powered after talks with Honda fall through.

Williams - Honda
Felipe Massa
Jolyon Palmer

Williams swap to Honda power after big Honda improvements, and Frank Williams sees something in Palmer after a reasonable 2016 so replaces the Ferrari-bound Bottas with him in an attempt to find the next Nigel Mansell or Damon Hill. Felipe is still there or thereabouts, but expect the odd podium, not wins.

Retired
Jenson Button - Get back on the podium in 2016 and can leave with his head held high.
Pastor Maldonado - Venezuela goes properly to hell, so no more sponsorship money for him. Seems genuinely surprised that no team now wants him.
Kimi Raikkonen - Not bad in 2016, but considering his pay he remains appalling value for money. Accepts the fact that Ferrari don't want him any more with traditional indifference.

Posted: **26 Jan 2016, 19:08**

Regardless, I still think that the team who will drive Nico Rosberg in 2017 will "accidentally" commit a faux pas and put his father name on the entry list instead. They are both Rosberg after all and its an easy mistake to do for someone like me who whenever hears the name Rosberg, thinks of the lovable and charismatic mustachioed driver instead.

Posted: **02 Feb 2016, 03:03**

If Bottas ain't in a Ferrari for this season, I can't honestly see him in one anytime in the future. His moment has passed and there are others on the block.

Posted: **02 Feb 2016, 12:15**

Izzyeviel wrote:If Bottas ain't in a Ferrari for this season, I can't honestly see him in one anytime in the future. His moment has passed and there are others on the block.

The new Hülkenberg - so we can expect him to win Le Mans. Speaking seriously, if not Ferrari, then I would expect Mercedes to pick Bottas up as Rosberg's replacement eventually (or Hamilton, should he jump ship). But maybe for 2018.

Assuming Räikkönen does stay at Ferrari for 2017 - and given their continued loyalty to Massa, I could see it happening - then I wonder whether Felipe Nasr might end up being his eventual replacement.

Posted: **02 Feb 2016, 14:10**

I want Hulkenberg to get a top seat and just show people why he never got one before.

The hype is so annoying. Poor guy getting hyped up so much.

Posted: **02 Feb 2016, 16:06**

I predict Honda will actually have a good engine in 2017.

Posted: **02 Feb 2016, 19:22**

They say history tends to repeat itself. The year Honda will have good engines will be the year where in the previous season they ended up leaving F1, again, forcing McLaren to run some rebadged Honda engines. Those units will be the good ones.

Posted: **03 Feb 2016, 08:16**

Renault hold the key. With their 2016 recuperation year out of the way, and a hefty budget piled into their 2017 challenger, plus the need for a top driver to lead the team, it gives an opportunity to a fast but marginalised driver to jump ship. Might Alonso give up on McLaren again and head back 'home' to finish his career off? Will they look to poach Ricciardo from their customer team? Or might they bring in Rosberg, determined to extricate himself from the shadow of Hamilton? Or may they even take a punt on Bottas, if his form returns to 2014 levels?

When we find out the answer to this, the rest of the cards will fall into place. Much like Kimi last season.

Posted: **03 Feb 2016, 10:12**

Biscione wrote:Renault hold the key. With their 2016 recuperation year out of the way, and a hefty budget piled into their 2017 challenger, plus the need for a top driver to lead the team, it gives an opportunity to a fast but marginalised driver to jump ship. (...) Or might they bring in Rosberg, determined to extricate himself from the shadow of Hamilton?

Posted: **03 Feb 2016, 10:49**

I doff my cap to you lot for being able to think so far in advance. I'm still weighing up this season.

Posted: **03 Feb 2016, 10:56**

CoopsII wrote:I doff my cap to you lot for being able to think so far in advance. I'm still weighing up this season.

I believe this is just desperation from us due to common belief that this season will be a copy of last season with a few tweaks, not all of those positive...

Grand Prix Rejects

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