Proposed Renault-Fiat Chrysler Merger

[mario]

I am not quite sure whether this should go in this thread or whether it should go elsewhere, but I thought that it might be worth discussing the announcement earlier today by Fiat Chrysler that they have put forward a proposal for a merger between themselves and Renault on equal terms.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-48420334

It is still being weighed up by the board at Renault, but it does make you wonder what might happen if the deal were to go ahead. Would the combined company still think it worthwhile to have two Formula 1 teams, with the two teams competing against - and arguably taking resources from - each other? Or might we be in a situation where the combined company decides to reduce their involvement and focusses their efforts on a single team?

[F1 Livery Histories]

Interesting to consider this. I would imagine that if FIAT, Chrysler & Renault were to merge than they would probably keep at least two of their marquees in F1. After all, we currently have Alfa & Ferrari competing on the same stage whilst under the direction of the same parent company.

However, if they all did merge into some kind a super team then perhaps we might finally get a team that can compete with Merc

[Faustus]

I've had concerns about Renault staying in Formula 1 for a while now. Renault needs a win desperately and I for one am hoping that the stars align and Renault manages to win a race in the near future. I don't think that Formula 1 can afford to lose an OEM, especially since there is no sign that any other OEMs are likely to join at any time soon.

[AustralianStig]

I thought that Fiat no longer owned Ferrari?

[FortiWinks]

I thought that Fiat no longer owned Ferrari?

Ferrari’s relationship with Fiat is in the “it’s complicated” stage because while it’s not in the Fiat empire it’s still partly owned by them.

Or it’s the other way round... anyway it’s something like the above.

[mario]

I've had concerns about Renault staying in Formula 1 for a while now. Renault needs a win desperately and I for one am hoping that the stars align and Renault manages to win a race in the near future. I don't think that Formula 1 can afford to lose an OEM, especially since there is no sign of any other OEMs are likely to join at any time soon.

You are right about the lack of interest from other OEMs, and indeed it is a problem that seems to be widespread across multiple different racing series right now. The ACO's attempts to secure more OEMs for the WEC is now becoming increasingly desperate, whilst IndyCar have been trying and failing for years to get somebody else to join Chevrolet and Honda - however, with a shortage of independents who could also step into the gap, it leaves F1 looking rather vulnerable if Renault were to go, especially given the trouble it could leave McLaren in as well.

We know from what Abiteboul has said in the past that, with the prospect of a budget cap on the horizon, the parent company does not want to put even more money into the team if it is going to then have to lay off those same people only a year or two down the line - if that does happen, it would be a waste of their money.

As things stand, the current budget and workforce that Renault have is about as much as the parent company is prepared to spend right now. They're really banking quite heavily on the budget cap process bringing the likes of Mercedes, Red Bull and Ferrari closer to the rest of the field, although right now they are not even all that effective at managing to be top of the midfield pack.

If that budget cap doesn't come in soon, or if it comes in at a higher level (as has been suggested), Renault might well not be profiting much, if at all, for several years to come - given the troubles at Renault, are they going to be prepared to stick it out for that long if they're not garnering significant success?

OK, it is true that they were under no illusions that it would take time to move towards the front - I believe they were looking towards the early 2020s for that - but, if they're now stalling out or arguably even falling back this year, will they start to get nervous about their long term plans and the lack of success so far?

Now, we would have a situation where the same company would have the Renault works team and the partnership with Sauber to run Alfa Romeo branded cars. When comparing the costs of competing and the potential benefit from those deals, would the combined company still want the expense of a full works team in Renault when they might decide that the Alfa Romeo deal gives better returns?

I thought that Fiat no longer owned Ferrari?

Ferrari’s relationship with Fiat is in the “it’s complicated” stage because while it’s not in the Fiat empire it’s still partly owned by them.

Or it’s the other way round... anyway it’s something like the above.

The Fiat-Chrysler Alliance (FCA) spun Ferrari off into an independent company and redistributed their stake in Ferrari to their shareholders, which means that FCA no longer has any significant stake in Ferrari. However, Exor N.V., which is an investment company run by the Agnelli family, does still hold significant stakes in both Ferrari (about 23%) and FCA (29%) - so whilst FCA does not have any direct control over Ferrari, they are indirectly linked as the holding company (Exor) holds a significant stake in both.

[Miguel98]

I've had concerns about Renault staying in Formula 1 for a while now. Renault needs a win desperately and I for one am hoping that the stars align and Renault manages to win a race in the near future. I don't think that Formula 1 can afford to lose an OEM, especially since there is no sign of any other OEMs are likely to join at any time soon.

You are right about the lack of interest from other OEMs, and indeed it is a problem that seems to be widespread across multiple different racing series right now. The ACO's attempts to secure more OEMs for the WEC is now becoming increasingly desperate, whilst IndyCar have been trying and failing for years to get somebody else to join Chevrolet and Honda - however, with a shortage of independents who could also step into the gap, it leaves F1 looking rather vulnerable if Renault were to go, especially given the trouble it could leave McLaren in as well.

We know from what Abiteboul has said in the past that, with the prospect of a budget cap on the horizon, the parent company does not want to put even more money into the team if it is going to then have to lay off those same people only a year or two down the line - if that does happen, it would be a waste of their money.

As things stand, the current budget and workforce that Renault have is about as much as the parent company is prepared to spend right now. They're really banking quite heavily on the budget cap process bringing the likes of Mercedes, Red Bull and Ferrari closer to the rest of the field, although right now they are not even all that effective at managing to be top of the midfield pack.

If that budget cap doesn't come in soon, or if it comes in at a higher level (as has been suggested), Renault might well not be profiting much, if at all, for several years to come - given the troubles at Renault, are they going to be prepared to stick it out for that long if they're not garnering significant success?

OK, it is true that they were under no illusions that it would take time to move towards the front - I believe they were looking towards the early 2020s for that - but, if they're now stalling out or arguably even falling back this year, will they start to get nervous about their long term plans and the lack of success so far?

Now, we would have a situation where the same company would have the Renault works team and the partnership with Sauber to run Alfa Romeo branded cars. When comparing the costs of competing and the potential benefit from those deals, would the combined company still want the expense of a full works team in Renault when they might decide that the Alfa Romeo deal gives better returns?

I thought that Fiat no longer owned Ferrari?

Ferrari’s relationship with Fiat is in the “it’s complicated” stage because while it’s not in the Fiat empire it’s still partly owned by them.

Or it’s the other way round... anyway it’s something like the above.

The Fiat-Chrysler Alliance (FCA) spun Ferrari off into an independent company and redistributed their stake in Ferrari to their shareholders, which means that FCA no longer has any significant stake in Ferrari. However, Exor N.V., which is an investment company run by the Agnelli family, does still hold significant stakes in both Ferrari (about 23%) and FCA (29%) - so whilst FCA does not have any direct control over Ferrari, they are indirectly linked as the holding company (Exor) holds a significant stake in both.

Regarding the state of most mobile series, it does seem most of the FIA main series are struggling with this. The WRC has struggled with his for a good few years, even though it has become a bit more secure and healthy in the last 3-4 years with the last rule change and Toyota joining the frame, but WEC is in serious problems.

The new rule package for WEC also hasn't worked as intended yet. Both BMW and Ford, who were rumoured to join the new prototype rulling for 2021 have announced that they are leaving WEC (while carrying on their IMSA programs, which makes me wonder if the ACO isn't connected with this), and only Ginneta have announced a program for the new ruleset, while it doesn't even seem sure that Toyota will carry on to the new rule package...

The only FIA series that seems quite healthy regarding manufacturer support is actually FE (and WTCR in a certain way, too, but that suffers from other issues). The ammount of manufacturers that are already in FE as today is massive compared to other FIA series, the level of competiviness is super high and, not just for the whole eletric energy thing, I think one of the big factors is that - basically, the level playing field is so high that anyone currently can win, and it gives great exposure to the team/manufacturers.

It wouldn't surprise me if Renault/Nissan decide to focus 100% on that program and leave F1 in 2021, even without a FIAT merge. Specially because the F1 project was connected to Carlos Ghosn, and with Ghosn out, I imagine Renault wouldn't be too happy with the current state of affairs in F1, and if the team doesn't improve in 2020, I can't see them staying, even with the rule change.

[mario]

Regarding the state of most mobile series, it does seem most of the FIA main series are struggling with this. The WRC has struggled with his for a good few years, even though it has become a bit more secure and healthy in the last 3-4 years with the last rule change and Toyota joining the frame, but WEC is in serious problems.

The new rule package for WEC also hasn't worked as intended yet. Both BMW and Ford, who were rumoured to join the new prototype rulling for 2021 have announced that they are leaving WEC (while carrying on their IMSA programs, which makes me wonder if the ACO isn't connected with this), and only Ginneta have announced a program for the new ruleset, while it doesn't even seem sure that Toyota will carry on to the new rule package...

The only FIA series that seems quite healthy regarding manufacturer support is actually FE (and WTCR in a certain way, too, but that suffers from other issues). The ammount of manufacturers that are already in FE as today is massive compared to other FIA series, the level of competiviness is super high and, not just for the whole eletric energy thing, I think one of the big factors is that - basically, the level playing field is so high that anyone currently can win, and it gives great exposure to the team/manufacturers.

It wouldn't surprise me if Renault/Nissan decide to focus 100% on that program and leave F1 in 2021, even without a FIAT merge. Specially because the F1 project was connected to Carlos Ghosn, and with Ghosn out, I imagine Renault wouldn't be too happy with the current state of affairs in F1, and if the team doesn't improve in 2020, I can't see them staying, even with the rule change.

I believe that Ford have hinted that their commitments to IMSA are only for 2019 - there has been some speculation they've investigated a DPi car, but they've been fairly inconsistent on whether they will or will not commit to that.

You're right about the WEC having fairly significant problems though, as it is stuck in a bad spot - none of the manufacturers which were talked about have offered any definite guarantees of entering, which has now seen the ACO floating the idea of a GTE Plus category as another fairly desperate measure.

The ACO are also known to have been meeting IMSA's representatives as well, with a few hints that the ACO might be prepared to abandon their "hypercar" plans altogether and simply co-opt the 2022 DPi regulations instead, with the aim of trying to encourage manufacturers to enter by allowing them to split costs and compete in both IMSA and ACO run series - although the 2022 DPi regulations have not yet been signed off either, making that a potentially tricky option too.

It is an issue that is facing a lot of series right now, with the enthusiasm of the manufacturers waning over time as they face pressure from new quarters, but at the same time independents are now more limited in numbers, less willing to enter due to the cost of competing and potentially may be less of a draw to the public.

With regards to Formula E, that might depend to some extent on whether the Renault-Nissan partnership does survive in the long term (that relationship has been under strain, especially with Ghosn's arrest and the suggestion that the charges against him were politically motivated).

I agree that Renault could well prefer to focus on that, given it is a low cost series where they might believe there are greater chances for success - and the growth in numbers in manufacturer entries, both current and future (Mercedes and Porsche are entering in 2019), is giving that series a fair chunk of prestige. I do agree that Renault downsizing to Formula E is a realistic prospect unless the F1 team starts showing much more success - the Sauber-Alfa Romeo deal might have better prospects for survival though, given that, as an advertising deal, it is cheaper to run than a full works efforts.

[Ataxia]

You're right about the WEC having fairly significant problems though, as it is stuck in a bad spot - none of the manufacturers which were talked about have offered any definite guarantees of entering, which has now seen the ACO floating the idea of a GTE Plus category as another fairly desperate measure.

One team - which shall remain nameless - has built something to the planned WEC 'hypercar' rules, so there's at least some possible representation...

[mario]

You're right about the WEC having fairly significant problems though, as it is stuck in a bad spot - none of the manufacturers which were talked about have offered any definite guarantees of entering, which has now seen the ACO floating the idea of a GTE Plus category as another fairly desperate measure.

One team - which shall remain nameless - has built something to the planned WEC 'hypercar' rules, so there's at least some possible representation...

It is at least some form of representation in that class, but it sounds like it is still a long way short of what the ACO had been hoping for given the number of manufacturers which were supposed to have been taking part in the initial discussions. The problem is that, over time, the ACO seem to have resorted to ever more desperate measures to try and solve their problems, but every time they seem to just put forward ideas that open up more questions than answers.

When the ACO relaxed the target times for the hypercars to the 3m30s range, that might have made it easier for manufacturers to hit that time, but then created the problem that the LMP2 cars are already lapping around Le Mans in the 3m28s bracket - so, the only way to create a gap for the hypercars to drop into would be to slow down the LMP2 cars significantly, which has, unsurprisingly, gone down very poorly with them.

The GTE Plus proposal would have allowed manufacturers to use their GTE cars as a basis for the top tier, but that was facing questions over whether that could be achieved in practise, not to mention the risk that it could shift the problem down to the GTE class if they removed the rationale for competing in that category.

As for copying the DPi rules, that might be the best compromise at this stage, but as I understand it, the IMSA was still negotiating with the manufacturers over those rules, given they were scheduled for 2022. There are also suggestions that Toyota is running out of patience over how long they are prepared to keep the TS050 going - delaying too long might see Toyota pull the plug with no promises of any replacement coming in their place.

The big issue around all this is that there is no clear idea of what will happen with the independent entrants either - it's assumed that there will be some sort of grandfathering mechanism for outfits like Rebellion, but with the various rules for the manufacturers still in such flux, nobody seems to have worked out what will happen to the independents yet either.

F1 is also kind of in a similar situation with the 2021 rule set as well - the initial proposal to drop the MGU-H element did seem to attract Porsche, particularly since it could have then used the same engine in the WEC and in F1, to the point where they did produce a bench test model.

However, the combination of the parent company pulling out of the WEC, cutting off funding for the project, and the talks over the 2021 rule set dragging on - some have suggested as a deliberate tactic by some teams to put Porsche off - Porsche backed away, and with no new entrants on the horizon, their tactics have gone to simply trying to keep the ones that they do have on board.

In the longer term, though, trying to get new manufacturers on board looks tricky for a lot of series, not just F1 - there was talk that IndyCar also tried to lure Porsche to join them. Porsche didn't want to commit to that, but the Carrera Cup - a much cheaper project for Porsche to fund - might be on the bill as a support race for IndyCar.

Some seem to be actively wanting a manufacturer collapse to occur in the belief that it'd force a return to the "old school" of F1 - you know the drill of what they want (loud high revving normally aspirated engines, manual gearboxes, the usual rose tinted nostalgia for a fantasy version of the 1990s). However, to me that shows that quite a few of those fans haven't thought through what they'd be left with if you got rid of most of those manufacturers, which would be an extremely rich privateer - Red Bull - against teams that were a fraction of their size, which I would see as just resulting in an even more lopsided competition that would make the current complaints about Mercedes domination look tame by comparison.

[CaptainGetz12]

You're right about the WEC having fairly significant problems though, as it is stuck in a bad spot - none of the manufacturers which were talked about have offered any definite guarantees of entering, which has now seen the ACO floating the idea of a GTE Plus category as another fairly desperate measure.

One team - which shall remain nameless - has built something to the planned WEC 'hypercar' rules, so there's at least some possible representation...

It is at least some form of representation in that class, but it sounds like it is still a long way short of what the ACO had been hoping for given the number of manufacturers which were supposed to have been taking part in the initial discussions. The problem is that, over time, the ACO seem to have resorted to ever more desperate measures to try and solve their problems, but every time they seem to just put forward ideas that open up more questions than answers.

When the ACO relaxed the target times for the hypercars to the 3m30s range, that might have made it easier for manufacturers to hit that time, but then created the problem that the LMP2 cars are already lapping around Le Mans in the 3m28s bracket - so, the only way to create a gap for the hypercars to drop into would be to slow down the LMP2 cars significantly, which has, unsurprisingly, gone down very poorly with them.

The GTE Plus proposal would have allowed manufacturers to use their GTE cars as a basis for the top tier, but that was facing questions over whether that could be achieved in practise, not to mention the risk that it could shift the problem down to the GTE class if they removed the rationale for competing in that category.

As for copying the DPi rules, that might be the best compromise at this stage, but as I understand it, the IMSA was still negotiating with the manufacturers over those rules, given they were scheduled for 2022. There are also suggestions that Toyota is running out of patience over how long they are prepared to keep the TS050 going - delaying too long might see Toyota pull the plug with no promises of any replacement coming in their place.

The big issue around all this is that there is no clear idea of what will happen with the independent entrants either - it's assumed that there will be some sort of grandfathering mechanism for outfits like Rebellion, but with the various rules for the manufacturers still in such flux, nobody seems to have worked out what will happen to the independents yet either.

F1 is also kind of in a similar situation with the 2021 rule set as well - the initial proposal to drop the MGU-H element did seem to attract Porsche, particularly since it could have then used the same engine in the WEC and in F1, to the point where they did produce a bench test model.

However, the combination of the parent company pulling out of the WEC, cutting off funding for the project, and the talks over the 2021 rule set dragging on - some have suggested as a deliberate tactic by some teams to put Porsche off - Porsche backed away, and with no new entrants on the horizon, their tactics have gone to simply trying to keep the ones that they do have on board.

In the longer term, though, trying to get new manufacturers on board looks tricky for a lot of series, not just F1 - there was talk that IndyCar also tried to lure Porsche to join them. Porsche didn't want to commit to that, but the Carrera Cup - a much cheaper project for Porsche to fund - might be on the bill as a support race for IndyCar.

Some seem to be actively wanting a manufacturer collapse to occur in the belief that it'd force a return to the "old school" of F1 - you know the drill of what they want (loud high revving normally aspirated engines, manual gearboxes, the usual rose tinted nostalgia for a fantasy version of the 1990s). However, to me that shows that quite a few of those fans haven't thought through what they'd be left with if you got rid of most of those manufacturers, which would be an extremely rich privateer - Red Bull - against teams that were a fraction of their size, which I would see as just resulting in an even more lopsided competition that would make the current complaints about Mercedes domination look tame by comparison.

My question is how would DPi cars work at Le Mans? The Mulsanne is considerably longer than the ovals that DPI race on. Would it need a special aero package like Indycar has for Indianapolis? Such an idea could keep costs down with some of the car having spec parts.

As for the Hypercars unless the ACO will shoulder part of the funding for designing the cars they probably won't get more than 2 manufacturers at most. As much as I'd like to see GT1 return to Le Mans the manufacturers of back then don't have the same priorities now as they did in the 1990s. Unless perhaps the new "GT1" class could become an all-electric series? I'm not sure if the technology is there for all-electric cars to run for 24 hours at full speed however.

[dinizintheoven]

... Unless perhaps the new "GT1" class could become an all-electric series? I'm not sure if the technology is there for all-electric cars to run for 24 hours at full speed however.

And that is why we need something that we could call "Formula H"...

[dr-baker]

... Unless perhaps the new "GT1" class could become an all-electric series? I'm not sure if the technology is there for all-electric cars to run for 24 hours at full speed however.

And that is why we need something that we could call "Formula H"...

Google tells me Formula H is a broad range disinfectant, often used in veterinary clinics. Who or what needs disinfecting in this scenario? The ACO?

[Faustus]

Looks like the merger is off:

https://www.ft.com/content/ba034774-87e ... ac2431f453

https://www.theguardian.com/business/20 ... -collapses

[Pacific Edge]

I've had concerns about Renault staying in Formula 1 for a while now. Renault needs a win desperately and I for one am hoping that the stars align and Renault manages to win a race in the near future. I don't think that Formula 1 can afford to lose an OEM, especially since there is no sign that any other OEMs are likely to join at any time soon.

I agree, the amount of car manufacturer mergers is making it less and less likely that will see OEMs in F1. As for Renault specifically, they might look at the lack of top results, and pull the plug. I for one hope not.

[IceG]

Renault needs a win desperately

Well Singapore 2008 worked out well the last time we heard this story...

Renault do not seem to be taking F1 seriously. Hiring Ricciardo seemed to suggest that impression was wrong but they are very poor this year. The stories and reality of engine reliability aside their chassis, strategy and results are just lack-lustre. I can see Toro Rosso pulling ahead of them on merit and can see them finishing sixth at best in the constructor's championship.

[mario]

Looks like the merger is off:

https://www.ft.com/content/ba034774-87e ... ac2431f453

https://www.theguardian.com/business/20 ... -collapses

I'm surprised that FCA called things off quite that quickly, but it sounds as if the French government might have been acting a bit heavy handedly and perhaps ended up putting them off. It'll be interesting to see if either side does continue to chase prospects of mergers with other companies though.

My question is how would DPi cars work at Le Mans? The Mulsanne is considerably longer than the ovals that DPI race on. Would it need a special aero package like Indycar has for Indianapolis? Such an idea could keep costs down with some of the car having spec parts.

As for the Hypercars unless the ACO will shoulder part of the funding for designing the cars they probably won't get more than 2 manufacturers at most. As much as I'd like to see GT1 return to Le Mans the manufacturers of back then don't have the same priorities now as they did in the 1990s. Unless perhaps the new "GT1" class could become an all-electric series? I'm not sure if the technology is there for all-electric cars to run for 24 hours at full speed however.

There was a suggestion a couple of years back for the current DPi cars to run at Le Mans, which the ACO did consider for a while - that would have seen the DPi cars being tweaked so they could run in the privateer LMP1 category, mainly by changing the ballast and restrictor diameter.

If that idea was to go forward, it sounds as if that might be one route for the ACO to make it possible for DPi cars to compete at Le Mans. It might necessitate producing an additional low drag body kit for the race, but it could potentially be a lot cheaper than the "Hypercar" rules and might work in getting manufacturers on board if that were the case (I could see one or two manufacturers running both the WEC and IMSA series if they could use the same car in both series).

[CaptainGetz12]

My question is how would DPi cars work at Le Mans? The Mulsanne is considerably longer than the ovals that DPI race on. Would it need a special aero package like Indycar has for Indianapolis? Such an idea could keep costs down with some of the car having spec parts.

As for the Hypercars unless the ACO will shoulder part of the funding for designing the cars they probably won't get more than 2 manufacturers at most. As much as I'd like to see GT1 return to Le Mans the manufacturers of back then don't have the same priorities now as they did in the 1990s. Unless perhaps the new "GT1" class could become an all-electric series? I'm not sure if the technology is there for all-electric cars to run for 24 hours at full speed however.

There was a suggestion a couple of years back for the current DPi cars to run at Le Mans, which the ACO did consider for a while - that would have seen the DPi cars being tweaked so they could run in the privateer LMP1 category, mainly by changing the ballast and restrictor diameter.

If that idea was to go forward, it sounds as if that might be one route for the ACO to make it possible for DPi cars to compete at Le Mans. It might necessitate producing an additional low drag body kit for the race, but it could potentially be a lot cheaper than the "Hypercar" rules and might work in getting manufacturers on board if that were the case (I could see one or two manufacturers running both the WEC and IMSA series if they could use the same car in both series).

How many teams would feasibly run both ACO and IMSA if the DPi idea was the next LMP format?

And DPi did attract several manufacturers, including smaller manufacturers like Mazda and Acura. It may just be extra money for the existing manufacturers that make LMP2 chassis, as the four manufacturers that make chassis for DPi International all make or have made LMP1 or LMP2 chassis in the past (Dallara, Ligier, Riley, and Oreca), which may turn off those that want to make their own chassis as Toyota has claimed.

[mario]

My question is how would DPi cars work at Le Mans? The Mulsanne is considerably longer than the ovals that DPI race on. Would it need a special aero package like Indycar has for Indianapolis? Such an idea could keep costs down with some of the car having spec parts.

As for the Hypercars unless the ACO will shoulder part of the funding for designing the cars they probably won't get more than 2 manufacturers at most. As much as I'd like to see GT1 return to Le Mans the manufacturers of back then don't have the same priorities now as they did in the 1990s. Unless perhaps the new "GT1" class could become an all-electric series? I'm not sure if the technology is there for all-electric cars to run for 24 hours at full speed however.

There was a suggestion a couple of years back for the current DPi cars to run at Le Mans, which the ACO did consider for a while - that would have seen the DPi cars being tweaked so they could run in the privateer LMP1 category, mainly by changing the ballast and restrictor diameter.

If that idea was to go forward, it sounds as if that might be one route for the ACO to make it possible for DPi cars to compete at Le Mans. It might necessitate producing an additional low drag body kit for the race, but it could potentially be a lot cheaper than the "Hypercar" rules and might work in getting manufacturers on board if that were the case (I could see one or two manufacturers running both the WEC and IMSA series if they could use the same car in both series).

How many teams would feasibly run both ACO and IMSA if the DPi idea was the next LMP format?

And DPi did attract several manufacturers, including smaller manufacturers like Mazda and Acura. It may just be extra money for the existing manufacturers that make LMP2 chassis, as the four manufacturers that make chassis for DPi International all make or have made LMP1 or LMP2 chassis in the past (Dallara, Ligier, Riley, and Oreca), which may turn off those that want to make their own chassis as Toyota has claimed.

I think that Ford had been suggested as one party that had weighed up such a proposal, though the ACO seem to have changed their minds again - they're now moving away from the DPi rules for now and are trying to get the hypercar regulations back on track again.