2014 Silly Season Thread

roblo97 · Post by **roblo97** » 11 Oct 2013, 07:12

solarcold wrote:Rumours wandering around Russia: Petrov\Sirotkin line-up for Sauber

Would have been a great lineup for Marussia though

dr-baker · Post by **dr-baker** » 11 Oct 2013, 11:57

Shizuka wrote:
solarcold wrote:Rumours wandering around Russia: Petrov\Sirotkin line-up for Sauber

That could absolutely work. No language barrier between the two either.

Would be a barrier between them and the team though...

Shizuka · Post by **Shizuka** » 11 Oct 2013, 11:59

dr-baker wrote:Would be a barrier between them and the team though...

Yes, that however would cause some problems.

solarcold · Post by **solarcold** » 11 Oct 2013, 19:21

Shizuka wrote:
dr-baker wrote:Would be a barrier between them and the team though...

Yes, that however would cause some problems.

We Russians aren't master English speakers, but I suppose Petrov can speak fairly well (though his pronounciation is some fun really), and I'm sure Sirotkin learns already.

roblo97 · Post by **roblo97** » 11 Oct 2013, 19:28

solarcold wrote:
Shizuka wrote:
dr-baker wrote:Would be a barrier between them and the team though...

Yes, that however would cause some problems.

We Russians aren't master English speakers, but I suppose Petrov can speak fairly well (though his pronounciation is some fun really), and I'm sure Sirotkin learns already.

i remember Petrov's interview after Melbourne 2011, and his pronounciation was very good so I am sure that Sirotkin will be fine.

Post by **kevinbotz** » 12 Oct 2013, 04:08

Peter Prodromou, Red Bull aero chief, set for return to McLaren.

:twisted:

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/110552

Hound55 · Post by **Hound55** » 12 Oct 2013, 04:18

kevinbotz wrote:Peter Prodromou, Red Bull aero chief, set for return to McLaren.

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/110552

I don't care about the implications for Red Bull, this is great enough just for McLaren

Post by **kevinbotz** » 12 Oct 2013, 07:57

Hound55 wrote:
kevinbotz wrote:Peter Prodromou, Red Bull aero chief, set for return to McLaren.

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/110552

I don't care about the implications for Red Bull, this is great enough just for McLaren

I wholeheartedly agree. Prodromou is unequivocally a very potent asset

As a McLaren fan, I do derive a perverse catharsis from the fact that my favorite team has strengthened itself at the expense of Red Bull, especially following their ransacking by Mercedes at the end of last year.

Shizuka · Post by **Shizuka** » 12 Oct 2013, 08:59

This brings up a question then: what exactly is McLaren aiming for then next year? Prodromou and Honda is still a season away, Mercedes will only support with the bare minimum, and the only change will probably be the new title sponsorship, most likely by Telmex. This absolutely feels like a Williams '99 to me. They still used Renault engines with BMW confirmed for '00.

Post by **kevinbotz** » 12 Oct 2013, 09:22

Shizuka wrote:This brings up a question then: what exactly is McLaren aiming for then next year? Prodromou and Honda is still a season away, Mercedes will only support with the bare minimum, and the only change will probably be the new title sponsorship, most likely by Telmex. This absolutely feels like a Williams '99 to me. They still used Renault engines with BMW confirmed for '00.

I would be callow and opine that McLaren will challenge for the championship next season, but I can't overlook that, as you've mentioned above, there are a multitude of factors weighing against them for 2014.

Realistically, I expect their focus to be on consolidating their partnership with Honda and on continuing the process of bolstering their technical department. With regards to performance, though I don't believe we'll witness a repeat of this year's catastrophes, I can't see them being consistent enough to challenge for a title. Most likely, they'll be aiming for third or fourth in the Constructor's Championship and mount a serious challenge for 2015.

Alextrax52 · Post by **Alextrax52** » 12 Oct 2013, 09:35

solarcold wrote:
Shizuka wrote:
dr-baker wrote:Would be a barrier between them and the team though...

Yes, that however would cause some problems.

We Russians aren't master English speakers, but I suppose Petrov can speak fairly well (though his pronounciation is some fun really), and I'm sure Sirotkin learns already.

The Russians on the Biathlon World Cup don't speak any English at all so i see what you mean

Post by **mario** » 12 Oct 2013, 16:51

kevinbotz wrote:
Shizuka wrote:This brings up a question then: what exactly is McLaren aiming for then next year? Prodromou and Honda is still a season away, Mercedes will only support with the bare minimum, and the only change will probably be the new title sponsorship, most likely by Telmex. This absolutely feels like a Williams '99 to me. They still used Renault engines with BMW confirmed for '00.

I would be callow and opine that McLaren will challenge for the championship next season, but I can't overlook that, as you've mentioned above, there are a multitude of factors weighing against them for 2014.

Realistically, I expect their focus to be on consolidating their partnership with Honda and on continuing the process of bolstering their technical department. With regards to performance, though I don't believe we'll witness a repeat of this year's catastrophes, I can't see them being consistent enough to challenge for a title. Most likely, they'll be aiming for third or fourth in the Constructor's Championship and mount a serious challenge for 2015.

Prodromou is a pretty high profile signing for McLaren - Newey may be the figurehead for Red Bull, but Prodromou has been quite influential in his own right and it shows from the fact that, despite the public comments, they don't seem keen for him to leave the team.

However, realistically he is only going to have a significant impact for McLaren from late 2015 at the earliest, and probably more towards 2016 instead, given that McLaren will probably start developing their 2015 car from mid 2014. They are probably going to be more competitive in 2014 given the reforms they've made after this year, but the reduction in support from Mercedes and the smaller slice of the end of year prize winnings from FOM is likely to hurt them in 2014 and is likely to knock their competitiveness back a bit.
Overall, I'd agree that 3rd is a respectable goal for 2014 - you would expect Mercedes to be in a stronger position given that they will be designing the engine around their car rather than helping McLaren (possibly causing integration issues for the latter team) whilst Red Bull's financial muscle will also be hard to beat. Still, if the rumours of Ferrari's engine being weak are true and are coupled to bigger financial problems or further losses of technical staff from Lotus, those two teams are potentially beatable next year.

Post by **Londoner** » 13 Oct 2013, 08:48

Eddie Jordan has apparently said that Hulkenberg is on his way back to Force India, and Massa is heading to Lotus.

For once, I hope he's wrong. Or at least he got the names mixed up.

good_Ralf · Post by **good_Ralf** » 13 Oct 2013, 09:12

East Londoner wrote:Eddie Jordan has apparently said that Hulkenberg is on his way back to Force India, and Massa is heading to Lotus.

For once, I hope he's wrong. Or at least he got the names mixed up.

If Eddie is getting his info from other teams (which was likely to be the reason why he correctly predicted the 'Kimi to Ferrari' move) then he is probably right.

Post by **kevinbotz** » 13 Oct 2013, 09:18

East Londoner wrote:Eddie Jordan has apparently said that Hulkenberg is on his way back to Force India, and Massa is heading to Lotus.

For once, I hope he's wrong. Or at least he got the names mixed up.

That...that's just not right. How much more does Hulkenberg need to do to land a competitive seat, for crying out loud.

SgtPepper · Post by **SgtPepper** » 13 Oct 2013, 09:57

good_Ralf wrote:
East Londoner wrote:Eddie Jordan has apparently said that Hulkenberg is on his way back to Force India, and Massa is heading to Lotus.

For once, I hope he's wrong. Or at least he got the names mixed up.

If Eddie is getting his info from other teams (which was likely to be the reason why he correctly predicted the 'Kimi to Ferrari' move) then he is probably right.

You've GOT to be joking.

This is the icing on today's abysmal cake.

Svenko Wankerov · Post by **Svenko Wankerov** » 13 Oct 2013, 10:02

SgtPepper wrote:
good_Ralf wrote:
East Londoner wrote:Eddie Jordan has apparently said that Hulkenberg is on his way back to Force India, and Massa is heading to Lotus.

For once, I hope he's wrong. Or at least he got the names mixed up.

If Eddie is getting his info from other teams (which was likely to be the reason why he correctly predicted the 'Kimi to Ferrari' move) then he is probably right.

You've GOT to be joking.

This is the icing on today's abysmal cake.

It wouldn't be all bad though. This scenario would almost certainly rid F1 of the di Resta virus.

pi314159 · Post by **pi314159** » 13 Oct 2013, 10:17

Svenko Wankerov wrote:It wouldn't be all bad though. This scenario would almost certainly rid F1 of the di Resta virus.

You only come here for insulting di Resta. There are many reasons to criticize him, but the way you're doing it is unacceptable.

roblo97 · Post by **roblo97** » 13 Oct 2013, 10:37

pi314159 wrote:
Svenko Wankerov wrote:It wouldn't be all bad though. This scenario would almost certainly rid F1 of the di Resta virus.

You only come here for insulting di Resta. There are many reasons to criticize him, but the way you're doing it is unacceptable.

How about everyone shut up about this because it doesn't help matters.

Shizuka · Post by **Shizuka** » 13 Oct 2013, 10:44

East Londoner wrote:Eddie Jordan has apparently said that Hulkenberg is on his way back to Force India, and Massa is heading to Lotus.

What else does Hülkenberg have to do to get into at least a McLaren? He's single handedly kicking Toro Rosso's ass, and Sauber is now on the way to catch Force India...

The Dutch Bear · Post by **The Dutch Bear** » 13 Oct 2013, 12:16

East Londoner wrote:Eddie Jordan has apparently said that Hulkenberg is on his way back to Force India, and Massa is heading to Lotus.

For once, I hope he's wrong. Or at least he got the names mixed up.

During the build up for qualifying Eddie Jordan said Massa would go to Force India, given his supposed Petrobras sponsorship doesn't mix with the sponsorship of Total that Lotus has.
Somehow Jordan changed his mind or got the names wrong. To be honest I haven't seen Eddie Jordan say that this morning, I was watching the closing stages of the Bathurst 1000.

Post by **Ataxia** » 13 Oct 2013, 12:18

The Dutch Bear wrote:
East Londoner wrote:Eddie Jordan has apparently said that Hulkenberg is on his way back to Force India, and Massa is heading to Lotus.

For once, I hope he's wrong. Or at least he got the names mixed up.

During the build up for qualifying Eddie Jordan said Massa would go to Force India, given his supposed Petrobras sponsorship doesn't mix with the sponsorship of Total that Lotus has.
Somehow Jordan changed his mind or got the names wrong. To be honest I haven't seen Eddie Jordan say that this morning, I was watching the closing stages of the Bathurst 1000.

I hope you're right, because I think that would be a much...nicer series of events.

CoopsII · Post by **CoopsII** » 13 Oct 2013, 15:00

I notice Edmund doesnt think Maldonado will be at Williams next year, I wonder where he'll end up?

andrew2209 · Post by **andrew2209** » 13 Oct 2013, 15:26

CoopsII wrote:I notice Edmund doesnt think Maldonado will be at Williams next year, I wonder where he'll end up?

Nowhere hopefully. His attitude and driving speak for themselves.

solarcold · Post by **solarcold** » 13 Oct 2013, 15:32

Metaphorically speaking, he's nowhere already.

good_Ralf · Post by **good_Ralf** » 13 Oct 2013, 16:59

The Williams drivers are in trouble

SgtPepper · Post by **SgtPepper** » 13 Oct 2013, 17:41

good_Ralf wrote:The Williams drivers are in trouble

Something about that move, and Maldonado's body language, come across to me like a man who is really starting to feel the pressure from a rookie teammate, and (understandably) struggling with the shift from a winning 2012, to backmarker 2013.

Alextrax52 · Post by **Alextrax52** » 13 Oct 2013, 17:43

SgtPepper wrote:
good_Ralf wrote:The Williams drivers are in trouble

Something about that move, and Maldonado's body language, come across to me like a man who is really starting to feel the pressure from a rookie teammate, and (understandably) struggling with the shift from a winning 2012, to backmarker 2013.

True but considering Maldonado was in a similar position in 2011 with Williams you probably would have expected him to have dealt with the situation a lot better

Post by **mario** » 13 Oct 2013, 19:26

Shizuka wrote:
East Londoner wrote:Eddie Jordan has apparently said that Hulkenberg is on his way back to Force India, and Massa is heading to Lotus.

What else does Hülkenberg have to do to get into at least a McLaren? He's single handedly kicking Toro Rosso's ass, and Sauber is now on the way to catch Force India...

Hulkenberg's problem is the fact that so many teams want to establish long term relationships with drivers that they have invested in, not to mention that the top tier drivers are not keen to move on or have a new driver break into their world.

I suppose that another problem Hulkenberg has had is that he hasn't always tended to start seasons off on a strong footing, which probably means that he tends to drift out of contention a little when the first phase of contract talks begin.

2012 would perhaps be a good example - whilst given the opportunity to take part in 14 free practise sessions in 2011, di Resta seemed to have the measure of him for the majority of the season. Hulkenberg's best performances took place in the final third of the year (i.e. mostly within the last six races) - the problem is that that run of form only really started in October.
By that point in time, Hamilton had committed to Mercedes and McLaren had committed to Perez, Lotus were finalising terms with Kimi and Grosjean, Massa had persuaded Ferrari to renew his contract after he had shown a stronger run of form in the previous few races, Webber had already signed up for one last year with Red Bull during the summer and most of the other major players were on existing long term contracts and therefore already had secure seats in top teams.

Hulkenberg's form did attract attention and praise from team bosses in late 2012, but after the Singapore GP - which was the race before his upturn in form - he only had 31 points in the WDC and lay in 14th place. He was behind his team mate, behind the soon to be sacked Kobayashi and only a few points ahead of the inconsistent Maldonado and struggling Bruno Senna, making it harder for him to sell himself to the top teams.

This season has been similar, although that would appear to be more down to Sauber's difficulties rather than Hulkenberg directly - although he drove hard in the opening races, he could only scrape minor points finishes at best and couldn't gain any credit for beating Gutierrez given he was expected to beat him. It always seems to be the case that his best performances come too late in the season to effect the decision making process, such that he can't put himself into the spotlight just when he needs to do so.

His talks with Ferrari stalled during the Hungarian GP, whereas Kimi was coming off the back of a near victory in Germany and picked up another podium in Hungary, Button seems to have already secured his slot with McLaren before Hulkenberg's recent improvements, Mercedes have no incentive to change what has been a fairly closely matched pairing where the two drivers seem to have a very good working relationship and Red Bull had one driver locked in and another being prepared at Toro Rosso. Perez is perhaps vulnerable, but McLaren may yet feel that they can guide him to strike a better balance between pace, aggression and consistency.
Eually, Grosjean's chances of staying at Lotus are improving with his upturn in performances recently, so Hulkenberg now finds himself having to compete for the remaining seat at Lotus against other drivers whose financial backing might tip things in their favour (Boullier has said that he is keen to avoid a pay driver, but also accepts that he might have to if he cannot improve the financial situation of the team). Boullier's comments indicate that he is favoured by Lotus, but can Lotus, in turn, deliver for him given the loss of more key personnel and their precarious finances?

Cynon · Post by **Cynon** » 13 Oct 2013, 20:01

CoopsII wrote:I notice Edmund doesnt think Maldonado will be at Williams next year, I wonder where he'll end up?

Hopefully Lotus. A leading team needs a driver as crazy as Maldolan.

Aerospeed · Post by **Aerospeed** » 13 Oct 2013, 22:27

Cynon wrote:
CoopsII wrote:I notice Edmund doesnt think Maldonado will be at Williams next year, I wonder where he'll end up?

Hopefully Lotus. A leading team needs a driver as crazy as Maldolan.

It's not a bad idea, actually, Maldonado has toned down his crashes this year. Grosjean and Maldonado would make a great pairing. And I doubt Lotus would think twice about his sponsorship cash, if he still has it. (Given what happened to Chaves)

Minardi Man · Post by **Minardi Man** » 13 Oct 2013, 22:51

Aerospeed wrote:
Cynon wrote:
CoopsII wrote:I notice Edmund doesnt think Maldonado will be at Williams next year, I wonder where he'll end up?

Hopefully Lotus. A leading team needs a driver as crazy as Maldolan.

It's not a bad idea, actually, Maldonado has toned down his crashes this year. Grosjean and Maldonado would make a great pairing. And I doubt Lotus would think twice about his sponsorship cash, if he still has it. (Given what happened to Chaves)

Ah, but then there's the question of Hulk again.
Most likely I see Williams retaining Maldonald, as the main reason why he is there ($) is still needed by the team and presumably something he can still bring.
Enstone will likely sign up Hulk, at the very least it would be a crying shame if he didn't get the gig, Hulk is definitely top team tier, if maybe not a potential championship contender, but of course he should still be given a chance to prove himself.
I think Force India would be the most interesting place to watch this silly season, both their current drivers seem far from secure their, and with a mix of veterans such as massa and koboyashi, and as always numerous youngsters all without f1 drives for next year so far, it could be a very different looking Force India team come 2014.

lgaquino · Post by **lgaquino** » 13 Oct 2013, 23:32

But between Sauber and Findia, wouldn't it be better to stay at Sauber, now that they finally found pace again?

A team secured by russian money seems a bit dodgy, but Findia is often in the news about money insecurities too

go_Rubens · Post by **go_Rubens** » 13 Oct 2013, 23:38

lgaquino wrote:But between Sauber and Findia, wouldn't it be better to stay at Sauber, now that they finally found pace again?

Possibly, but Hülkenberg has done his Sauber contract in a long time ago.

A team secured by russian money seems a bit dodgy, but Findia is often in the news about money insecurities too

Both outfits are dodgy right now. If I were a driver, I wouldn't be keen on Force India. Unless I'm an aspiring driver for McLaren like Magnussen. Then I'd take a chance.

solarcold · Post by **solarcold** » 14 Oct 2013, 11:47

What's so dodgy about russian money?

Yes, we're a monster machine of bureaucracy, we tend to fail to do things in time, always red tapes with contracts and projects, but we are doing our best to make our path into the world of autosport.

lgaquino · Post by **lgaquino** » 14 Oct 2013, 12:31

hehe don't get me wrong mate, it's not about Russia itself.. but historically, in F1, there were a few times where a struggling team found a russian sponsor no one had a clue about. and then they quickly disappeared.

(Although I gotta say at least Russia IS trying. Unlike Brazil here, that matches your description there ..except for the ending)

solarcold · Post by **solarcold** » 14 Oct 2013, 12:42

Yea, I recall that Gazprom\Minardi failure.

Post by **kevinbotz** » 14 Oct 2013, 15:37

Hulkenberg 2014 contract signed; destination nebulous.

http://www.jamesallenonf1.com/2013/10/h ... s-heading/

watka · Post by **watka** » 15 Oct 2013, 00:09

Re: Russian investors, at least they're not Qadbak.

Post by **kevinbotz** » 15 Oct 2013, 14:01

Lotus poised to finalize financial agreement with Quantum Motorsports, formerly Infinity Racing.

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/110658