The HRT thread

thehemogoblin · Post by **thehemogoblin** » 22 Mar 2011, 19:30

F1000X wrote:Can someone explain to me how they managed to bid from the FIA back in 2009? USF1, as farcical as it was came with the false promise of bringing US interest to the sport. What did Campos bring to the table?

It's the first-ever Spanish team.

Phoenix, your thoughts?

Ferrim · Post by **Ferrim** » 22 Mar 2011, 20:12

I'm not Phoenix, but I would say that the racing record of Campos in lower series was very good, and Dallara are half-competent at making chassis. They were also keen on using the Cosworth engine, as Mosley wanted, and they were the kind of low-budget team that Mad Max wanted for his cost-capped Formula 1.

Phoenix · Post by **Phoenix** » 22 Mar 2011, 22:14

Ferrim wrote:I'm not Phoenix, but I would say that the racing record of Campos in lower series was very good, and Dallara are half-competent at making chassis. They were also keen on using the Cosworth engine, as Mosley wanted, and they were the kind of low-budget team that Mad Max wanted for his cost-capped Formula 1.

Above all, I'd say that Campos promised to get juicy Spanish investments, something which as we all know overestimated and in which he failed miserably. When Carabante took over the team, they were already on the entry list and nothing could be done about that. So they'll hang on it until they finally run short of money. If Bernie is trying to save the team it's because he doesn't want the sport to get somewhat discredited because they admitted a team that was very weak financially and collapsed shortly after entering the sport.

And, well, Spain is Spain. Creating overambitious ventures then find ourselves in hot water is our speciality :lol:

Myrvold · Post by **Myrvold** » 22 Mar 2011, 22:43

Oh well. I guess this is the same source that said they would collapse before then end of last season. Never got the new car, or any Williams parts!

Cynon · Post by **Cynon** » 22 Mar 2011, 23:58

Looks like Karthikeyan will be back in NASCAR after all.

TomWazzleshaw · Post by **TomWazzleshaw** » 23 Mar 2011, 04:04

Phoenix wrote:If Bernie is trying to save the team it's because he doesn't want the sport to get somewhat discredited because they admitted a team that was very weak financially and collapsed shortly after entering the sport.

How much more discredited can the sport get after the political BS that's gone down in the last decade?

Post by **mario** » 23 Mar 2011, 08:45

MaxZero wrote:http://old.motorsport.com/news/article.asp?ID=402107&FS=F1

Apparently the engineers haven't been paid in two months leading to 5 resignations, and a big fib about the customs hold up

This sounds fantastically bad

Hmm, if true, then it sounds like the team are in a more desperate situation than they'd like to admit. Just losing five engineers so close to the start of the season will hurt the team, if true, but the fact that they've not been paid for so long does sound like a team in terminal decline.

patrick wrote:
MaxZero wrote:http://old.motorsport.com/news/article.asp?ID=402107&FS=F1

Apparently the engineers haven't been paid in two months leading to 5 resignations, and a big fib about the customs hold up

This sounds fantastically bad

The news coincides with rumours in Germany that Bernie Ecclestone is now getting involved with the team's survival.

Interesting, but why would he do that? I thought he wants less teams now. Although, I think he hates virgin more than HRT actually, he expected branson to throw a lot of money at it most likely...

Possibly because he wants a dissenting voice amongst the teams to sow discord and confusion just before the Concorde Agreement is about to be renegotiated? HRT have recently begun to support some of Bernie's comments, such as those relating to downsizing the grid, and have not always seen eye to eye with their other competitors. Perhaps he is trying to buy their support?
Alternatively, as others have suggested, he might be trying to protect the image of the sport by helping the team survive until the end of the season. However, he hasn't ever really shown any sympathy towards HRT before - he even predicted once that they would run out of money - so why he would suddenly have such overwhelming sympathy, and moreover money, for them is a bit peculiar.

DanielPT · Post by **DanielPT** » 23 Mar 2011, 10:42

mario wrote:
patrick wrote:
MaxZero wrote:http://old.motorsport.com/news/article.asp?ID=402107&FS=F1

Apparently the engineers haven't been paid in two months leading to 5 resignations, and a big fib about the customs hold up

This sounds fantastically bad

The news coincides with rumours in Germany that Bernie Ecclestone is now getting involved with the team's survival.

Interesting, but why would he do that? I thought he wants less teams now. Although, I think he hates virgin more than HRT actually, he expected branson to throw a lot of money at it most likely...

Possibly because he wants a dissenting voice amongst the teams to sow discord and confusion just before the Concorde Agreement is about to be renegotiated? HRT have recently begun to support some of Bernie's comments, such as those relating to downsizing the grid, and have not always seen eye to eye with their other competitors. Perhaps he is trying to buy their support?
Alternatively, as others have suggested, he might be trying to protect the image of the sport by helping the team survive until the end of the season. However, he hasn't ever really shown any sympathy towards HRT before - he even predicted once that they would run out of money - so why he would suddenly have such overwhelming sympathy, and moreover money, for them is a bit peculiar.

There have rumours for a while that Bernie has been making an effort to help new teams ever since news about their struggles have come to public. Some even said that it is only thanks to Bernie that HRT made to the grid last season. Possibly he is trying to extract some favours from HRT in order to split the teams. Anyway, it would explain a bit the money the team had in order to design this year car...

Waris · Post by **Waris** » 23 Mar 2011, 11:24

This team has been in decline since before it even started its first race.
Of course it's not going to stick around for a very long time, so let's not worry about that, but rather enjoy it while it lasts!

S951 · Post by **S951** » 23 Mar 2011, 12:00

it lives!! sort of......

DanielPT · Post by **DanielPT** » 23 Mar 2011, 12:02

S951 wrote:it lives!! sort of......

Did they forgot to pack the rest of it? Or it got stuck in customs? :lol:

S951 · Post by **S951** » 23 Mar 2011, 12:47

another!

NK "was we not supposed to do this seat fitting a few weeks ago??"

Phoenix · Post by **Phoenix** » 23 Mar 2011, 22:30

mario wrote: HRT have recently begun to support some of Bernie's comments, such as those relating to downsizing the grid.

Why would HRT support that statement? It would be one of the teams to lose out.

Ed24 · Post by **Ed24** » 24 Mar 2011, 03:58

Apparently they don't even have an Adjustable Rear Wing.

That alone might just push them over the 107% barrier.

deCrasheris · Post by **deCrasheris** » 24 Mar 2011, 04:26

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/90114

And the publicocrapomiter explodes :lol:

Cynon · Post by **Cynon** » 24 Mar 2011, 06:01

DanielPT wrote:
S951 wrote:it lives!! sort of......

Did they forgot to pack the rest of it? Or it got stuck in customs?

No, they were experimenting with anti-gravity engines.

Post by **tommykl** » 24 Mar 2011, 06:50

deCrasheris wrote:http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/90114

And the publicocrapomiter explodes

What was he smoking??

eagleash · Post by **eagleash** » 24 Mar 2011, 09:26

Liuzzi merely said there's always a chance of points, which is true allowing for possible reliability issues for others, but that seeing the chequered flag was far more important & must be their first goal.

Personally, I'll be pleased if they just manage to at least start!

S951 · Post by **S951** » 24 Mar 2011, 10:21

holy cow look here

DanielPT · Post by **DanielPT** » 24 Mar 2011, 10:49

tommykl wrote:
deCrasheris wrote:http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/90114

And the publicocrapomiter explodes

What was he smoking??

eagleash wrote:Liuzzi merely said there's always a chance of points, which is true allowing for possible reliability issues for others, but that seeing the chequered flag was far more important & must be their first goal.

Personally, I'll be pleased if they just manage to at least start!

The boy has a point. I remember Adelaide 95, were the attrition rate was such that Lamy scored a point! And a Forti finished seventh! And who can forget Panis win at Monaco 96? In a Ligier Mugen-Honda? Anything can happen!

*

They obviously must qualify first...

TomWazzleshaw · Post by **TomWazzleshaw** » 24 Mar 2011, 10:56

DanielPT wrote:
eagleash wrote:Liuzzi merely said there's always a chance of points, which is true allowing for possible reliability issues for others, but that seeing the chequered flag was far more important & must be their first goal.

Personally, I'll be pleased if they just manage to at least start!

The boy has a point. I remember Adelaide 95, were the attrition rate was such that Lamy scored a point! And a Forti finished seventh! And who can forget Panis win at Monaco 96? In a Ligier Mugen-Honda? Anything can happen! *

They obviously must qualify first...

He's 54 Daniel PT, he's 54.* :lol:

*Well, atleast I think he is. And besides it fits the reworded quote I stole off HIGNFY.

DanielPT · Post by **DanielPT** » 24 Mar 2011, 11:02

Wizzie wrote:
DanielPT wrote:
eagleash wrote:Liuzzi merely said there's always a chance of points, which is true allowing for possible reliability issues for others, but that seeing the chequered flag was far more important & must be their first goal.

Personally, I'll be pleased if they just manage to at least start!

The boy has a point. I remember Adelaide 95, were the attrition rate was such that Lamy scored a point! And a Forti finished seventh! And who can forget Panis win at Monaco 96? In a Ligier Mugen-Honda? Anything can happen! *

They obviously must qualify first...

He's 54 Daniel PT, he's 54.*

*Well, atleast I think he is. And besides it fits the reworded quote I stole off HIGNFY.

I was actually talking about Liuzzi! But nice catch!

Henrique · Post by **Henrique** » 24 Mar 2011, 11:59

http://www.gpupdate.net/en/f1-news/255291/karthikeyan-admits-to-hrt-qualifying-fears/

That's better.

DanielPT · Post by **DanielPT** » 24 Mar 2011, 12:15

Henrique wrote:http://www.gpupdate.net/en/f1-news/255291/karthikeyan-admits-to-hrt-qualifying-fears/

That's better.

Narain Karthikeyan wrote:Yes, of course it’s a concern, but we believe the car is a good step forward with the Williams rear end and everything else, so it should be a positive step - at least on paper, but until you drive you never know.

What he said: "Yes, of course it's a concern, but we believe the Williams rear end is a step forward regardless the rest of the car being basically last year car. Of course this changes can make the car 'undrivable' but until you drive you never know."

S951 · Post by **S951** » 24 Mar 2011, 13:37

look look car is semi built

Pointrox · Post by **Pointrox** » 25 Mar 2011, 06:47

Quoting some Japanese commentator:

AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH!

I just woke up and checked ze results - HRT wasn't on track yet! I hope they'll get their stuff together and at least put ONE car on track in FP2.

sswishbone · Post by **sswishbone** » 25 Mar 2011, 07:06

It actually lived! Liuzzi managed to get it around for an installation lap... And it looks ghastly! I am well aware that they had no official sponsor drive, but to actually leave the likes of 'this could be you!' and 'this is cool F1 spot' on the bodywork? I doubt even Andrea Moda did that, truly rejectful! I can't wait to see what happens in qualifying

Jeroen Krautmeir · Post by **Jeroen Krautmeir** » 25 Mar 2011, 10:12

1 Lap is action?

Valrys · Post by **Valrys** » 25 Mar 2011, 10:55

Glad Hispania managed to actually get one car out on the track, apparantly Liuzzis car also had to be almost completely dismantled to solve a fuel leak as well which was why they were so late, while they're still flying in parts for Narain's car.

Hope that a miracle occurs and they get within 107% and/or the stewards let them start!

LucaPacchiarini · Post by **LucaPacchiarini** » 25 Mar 2011, 10:58

does anyone here agree with me that this has a bigger reject-potential that Lola 97 ? :twisted:

DanielPT · Post by **DanielPT** » 25 Mar 2011, 11:03

LucaPacchiarini wrote:does anyone here agree with me that this has a bigger reject-potential that Lola 97 ?

I do agree with you!

I wonder how they want to qualify in about 2 hours of race track. Seriously, it is worst than last year... The only problem is that without Sundays they look set to die quickly.

patrick · Post by **patrick** » 25 Mar 2011, 12:21

They appear to be using a lot of 2010 parts, either due to failing crash tests (as rumoured) or simply not having the supply. It'll be a miracle if they have two cars on track for qualifying

Valrys · Post by **Valrys** » 25 Mar 2011, 12:30

patrick wrote:They appear to be using a lot of 2010 parts, either due to failing crash tests (as rumoured) or simply not having the supply. It'll be a miracle if they have two cars on track for qualifying

Having seen the photos someone posted over at the autosport forums......

It looks like they've realised they won't get their 2011 car ready, and have merely repainted the 2010 one. I assume they 2010 cars would have been dissasembled at some point, and where probably sitting around back at the workshop, which may explain the lack of parts and late readying. In some ways that would actually be better - the 2010 car in Liuzzis hands with the Williams rear end wasn't too shabby at the pre-season tests...

Valrys · Post by **Valrys** » 25 Mar 2011, 12:33

And here are those pictures. After having a second look it probably is the 2011 car with 2010 bits bolted on, but that still bodes well for reliability and getting the car sorted out in FP3 for a sub-107% qualy time.

Jeroen Krautmeir · Post by **Jeroen Krautmeir** » 25 Mar 2011, 12:36

Surely bolting together parts of the 2010 car is going to upset aero balance and things like that, even if the new car is based on the old one.

DanielPT · Post by **DanielPT** » 25 Mar 2011, 12:38

Besides the fact that the old car was already miles off the pace...

Valrys · Post by **Valrys** » 25 Mar 2011, 12:42

DanielPT wrote:Besides the fact that the old car was already miles off the pace...

Like I said, the interim car they tested with, assuming the lead teams weren't sandbagging, wasn't too shabby on the pace.

eytl · Post by **eytl** » 25 Mar 2011, 13:00

I just love how the so-called new car is such a derivative of the old car that parts such as the nose and front wings are interchangeable at all!

patrick · Post by **patrick** » 25 Mar 2011, 13:12

eytl wrote:I just love how the so-called new car is such a derivative of the old car that parts such as the nose and front wings are interchangeable at all!

On the FP1 broadcast they mentioned the car was made by the same company that supplied Toro Rosso with the 2008 car (that won a race). The name of the company escapes me at the moment, but it wasn't Dallara as we know, so indeed, they have most likely deliberately constructed the car in such a manner, knowing full well they would need to use old parts.

Jeroen Krautmeir wrote:Surely bolting together parts of the 2010 car is going to upset aero balance

we would have to assume the car had any aero balance to begin with, which appears unlikely :lol:

Ferrim · Post by **Ferrim** » 25 Mar 2011, 14:06

eytl wrote:I just love how the so-called new car is such a derivative of the old car that parts such as the nose and front wings are interchangeable at all!

Osella anyone?